Erotic Humiliation - 8/14/09

[12:10] Pirate Russell: Anyway, let's get going here.....
[12:10] Pirate Russell: OK, those that will, please turn off any radars, MystiTools, etc., to help with the Horrendous lag
[12:10] Pirate Russell: Don't wory about that or this
[12:10] Pirate Russell: Please take all cross talk to IM, and all collar, etc commands to the secondary channels!
[12:10] Pirate Russell: Welcome to House of V's College of Kink! As most of y'all know, My name is Pirate Russell, Head Mistress of the College, and today's instructor. I have been in SL for 3 1/2 years, a lesbian Domme, the entire time.
[12:11] Pirate Russell: For any that need to leave early, all transcripts can be found at http://collegeofkink.blogspot.com
[12:11] Pirate Russell: .
[12:11] Pirate Russell: Erotic humiliation: The consensual use of psychological humiliation in a sexual context, whereby, at least, one person gains arousal or erotic excitement from the powerful emotions of being humiliated and demeaned, or of humiliating another;
[12:11] Pirate Russell: often (but not always) in conjunction with sexual stimulation of one or both partners in the activity. The humiliation need not be sexual in itself, as with many other sexual activities it is the feelings derived from it which are sought,
[12:11] Pirate Russell: regardless of the nature of the actual activity.
[12:12] Pirate Russell: Consider that the desire to be beneath the other partner during intercourse,the idea of "getting caught" such as with having sex in the garden or woods, or mild rape fantasies (where the person imagines themselves to be forced in a way they would like,
[12:12] Pirate Russell: and which must be seen as completely different to any real form of rape), are mild emotional games that emphasise status, vulnerability and control.
[12:12] Pirate Russell: However, for most people such ideas remain a fantasy and they would have strong reservations about it being made public, or engaged in with a partner for real, however erotic the idea may be.
[12:12] Pirate Russell: If a person does reveal their fetish to their partners, this usually is a result of a huge amount of trust invested in them, due to the similarly huge psychological struggle they would have had to have gone through to tell them.
[12:13] Pirate Russell: Actually goes for anything this personal, not just a fetish or THIS fetish
[12:13] Pirate Russell: Many people have the worry of being ridiculed for their fetish, and such ridicule from their partners could be psychologically catastrophic.
[12:13] Pirate Russell: Therefore, many people use online humiliation (where the humiliator and others are involved via the internet using chat, websites, SL, etc.) as a compromise between exhibitionism and reality on the one hand, and safety and anonymity on the other.
[12:14] Pirate Russell: Humiliation can be verbal or physical, and can be relatively private or public.
[12:14] Pirate Russell: Often it can become ritualized, and unlike some sexual variations it can also be easily carried out over a long distance or online.
[12:14] Pirate Russell: The distinction between humiliation and dominance in an activity such as erotic spanking is that the sought-after effect is primarily the humiliation; the activity is just a means to that end.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: While mild or moderate humiliation is not an uncommon part of BDSM or other sexual roleplay, humiliation play can be taken to a point where it becomes emotionally or psychologically distressing to one or the other partner.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: Erotic humiliation can become extreme enough to be considered a form of edgeplay, that some consider may best be approached with advance negotiation and use of a safeword.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: This is a highly subjective issue, and depends greatly on the participants.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: .
[12:15] Pirate Russell: ~Humiliation is not the same as dominance, as the devotee is not necessarily seeking to be ordered about.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: Humiliation comes into its own as a sexual force when the devotee seeks the humiliation over and above the means; for example, when being spanked is primarily valued because of the belittlement involved.
[12:16] ***DS***: i'm paying attention, *smiles, just been hexed by this chair
[12:16] Pirate Russell: Actually the TP didn't clear the pose at the forum
[12:16] ***DS***: ahh, thanks
[12:17] Pirate Russell: As such, it encompasses a range of paraphilia (abnormal sexual activity), in particular foot fetish or shoe fetish, body worship, spanking, bondage and most BDSM styles.
[12:18] Pirate Russell: It can be as basic as the desire to kiss and massage feet as a precursor to sex, or it can be complex, involving roleplay or public displays of subservience.
[12:18] Pirate Russell: MMmmm.... Public Displays......
[12:18] MystiTool HUD 1.3.1: Entering chat range: ***BH*** (2m)
[12:18] ***KR***: there is something very erotic about it
[12:19] Pirate Russell: ***DS***, ***KR***, this is My ***BH***
[12:19] ***KR***: hello***BH***
[12:19] Pirate Russell: Come kneel @ My feet, girl
[12:19] ***DS***: ahh
[12:19] Pirate Russell: Speaking of public displays...
[12:19] Pirate Russell: It can be for a set period of time (a "scene") or as an ongoing facet of a relationship.
[12:19] Pirate Russell: The "humiliation" is not intrinsic to the act or the object. Rather, symbiotic, a relationship beneficial to each charged, by the shared attitude of the partners engaged in the act.
[12:20] Pirate Russell: It is they who invest specific acts, objects or body-parts with a humiliating aspect.
[12:20] ***BH***: hi Mistress
[12:20] Pirate Russell: .
[12:20] ***BH***: hello Miss ***KR***
[12:20] Pirate Russell: ~ Means of Humiliation
[12:20] Pirate Russell: Sexual humiliation is very open-ended. Broadly, it can be divided into verbal and physical aspects.
[12:20] Pirate Russell: *Verbal aspects of this might include:
[12:20] Pirate Russell: ** Mockery, derision and ridicule.
[12:20] Pirate Russell: ** Verbal belittlement, such as "slave", "boy", "girl", "missy", "pet".
[12:20] Pirate Russell: ** Insults and verbal abuse, such as "fat", "ugly", "stupid", "worthless".
[12:21] Pirate Russell: ** Degrading references, such as "slut", "tart", "bitch" and "whore".
[12:21] Pirate Russell: ** Slighting of body parts or behaviors, such as disparaging or cruel references to breasts, facial appearance, genitalia or genital size, bottom, and slighting of mannerisms such as walking, responsiveness, standard of self-care.
[12:21] Pirate Russell: ** Having to ask permission for everyday activities such as going to the toilet, spending money or eating.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: ** Small breasts humiliation, where scorn is addressed over the supposed inadequacy of the adult female's breasts, or her inability to please a man (and by implication her essential worthlessness as a woman), and her breasts become objects of fun.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: ** Small penis humiliation, where scorn is addressed over the supposed inadequacy of the adult male's genitals, or his inability to please a woman (and by implication his essential worthlessness as a man), and his penis becomes an object of fun.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: ** Forced repetition, such as being obliged to repeat back commands to confirm them.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: ** Forced flattery, such as agreeing that every decision that the dominant makes is wise, correct, and justifiable, while additionally praising the dominant's physical and personality traits.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: Isn't that right, ***BH***?
[12:23] Pirate Russell: ** Reduction to Human animal roleplay or human pet, referring to these individuals as pet, dog, girl, bitch, or making them eat and drink from pet food and water bowls.
[12:23] Pirate Russell: .
[12:23] Pirate Russell: *Physical Humiliation:
[12:23] Pirate Russell: Some sexual humiliation involves inflicting pain, but much of it is far more concerned with ridicule, mocking, degradation and embarrassment.
[12:23] Pirate Russell: Physical and tangible aspects might include:
[12:24] Pirate Russell: ** Wearing of external signs of "ownership", such as a collar.
[12:24] Pirate Russell reaches down and tugs on ***BH***'s collar
[12:24] Pirate Russell: ** Forced to wear a gag and/or restraints on the body.
[12:24] Pirate Russell: ** Prohibitions or restrictions on clothing, even in public. For females a common example is being mandated to only wear revealing bikinis or lingerie. For men, this may include feminizing or cross-dressing.
[12:24] Pirate Russell: Both sexes may be expected to go completely nude, with decorative objects such as collars, bands, tiaras, or cuffs being the only exceptions.
[12:24] ***BH***: yes Mistress
[12:25] Pirate Russell pulls ***BH***'s shirt off
[12:25] ***BH*** eases a little closer releive the tug
[12:25] ***KR***: yes
[12:25] Pirate Russell: ** Having friends, family or strangers aware of or witnessing one's treatment (i.e.: public humiliation).
[12:25] Pirate Russell: Like y'all watching her shorts come down
[12:26] ***BH*** blushes
[12:26] Pirate Russell: ** Use of chastity belts or other means of erotic sexual denial.
[12:26] ***KR***: ***BH*** is branded?
[12:26] Pirate Russell: no, that's Gorean, she's tattood
[12:26] Pirate Russell: sweetie show them your tatts!
[12:26] ***KR***: same thing
[12:26] Pirate Russell: No, it's not
[12:27] ***KR***: denoted ownship, does it not
[12:27] Pirate Russell: Yes, but branding is scarring, tattoos use ink
[12:27] ***KR***: understand
[12:27] Pirate Russell: ** Suppressed freedom of movement. This may include never being able to leave the room in which the dominant is present without permission, and may be forbidden to leave the house or 'dungeon' in general for the duration of slavery or servitude.
[12:27] ***KR***: cute
[12:27] ***BH*** spins with cheeks getting redder
[12:28] Pirate Russell: ** Frequent performance of passive-aggressive sexual services for the dominant, such as erotic massage, cunnilingus, analingus, or fellatio, without expectations of reciprocal acts or intercourse.
[12:28] ***DS***: admires ***BH***'s form from his chair
[12:28] Pirate Russell: ** Specific rituals and affectations to be adopted. This includes displays of subservience, such as, walking a pace behind the dominant, only speaking when spoken to, kneeling or prostrating in front of the dominant when expecting orders,
[12:28] Pirate Russell: eating only after others or on the floor, low status place to sleep, and a wide variety of body worship activities such as kissing and/or licking the dominant's feet, boots, buttocks, anus, vulva etc. to express acknowledgment, subservience, shame, or eve
[12:28] Pirate Russell: ** Spanking, whipping, restraint or other BDSM activities such as cock and ball torture (CBT).
[12:29] Pirate Russell: ** Performance of menial tasks or abusive workload, such as cleaning the floors with a toothbrush.
[12:29] Pirate Russell: ** Detailed punishments for a variety of 'infractions' or misbehavior, such as having to stand in a corner facing a wall for several hours, flogging or whipping, reduced rations, or forced exercise.
[12:29] Pirate Russell: ** Roleplaying "lower status" beings, such as animals (for example dog or horse) or babies (see human animal roleplay, pup-play and adult baby play).
[12:29] Pirate Russell: That would be an EVEN LOWER status!
[12:29] Pirate Russell: ** Ejaculating, farting, defecating, spitting, slapping or urinating on the bottom's body, especially the face.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: ** Erotic objectification, where the bottom is cast in the role of an object, such as a footstool.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: ** Cuckoldry, taking on a third party lover to humiliate the bottom as an expression of the relationship between the top and the bottom.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: ** Having to ask permission to orgasm during sex or masturbation.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: The list is virtually endless, it all depends on what the bottom DOESN'T LIKE!
[12:31] Pirate Russell: Sexual roleplaying may or may not involve humiliation. For example, one person might play the part of a dog because they enjoy being mock-forced into it, and the top will emphasize the lowness of the bottom's status as an animal.
[12:31] Pirate Russell: Whereas another person might play the role of the dog without any element of humiliation, simply as an expression of their inner animal or playful spirit.
[12:31] Pirate Russell: .
[12:31] Pirate Russell: ~ Psychology of Humiliation
[12:31] Pirate Russell: Humiliation in general touches strong emotional buttons, the more so when it becomes sexualized.
[12:31] Pirate Russell grabs ***BH***'s hair and turns her towards the students
[12:32] Pirate Russell: Because of this, consent and (paradoxically) a high degree of awareness and communication is needed to ensure that the result is desirable, rather than abusive.
[12:32] Pirate Russell: For example, a submissive may enjoy being insulted in some ways, but be genuinely crushed and devastated if humiliated or insulted in other ways.
[12:32] ***BH*** whimpers and follows the tug
[12:32] Pirate Russell: Humiliation play is also connected to sexual fetishism, in that non-sexual activities may become sexualized by association with arousal,
[12:32] Pirate Russell: and also may be associated with exhibitionism in the sense of wanting others to witness (or being aroused by others witnessing) one's sexual degradation.
[12:33] Pirate Russell: For some people, activities such as name-calling are a way of achieving ego reduction or getting over sexual inhibitions.
[12:33] Pirate Russell: isn't that right, slut?
[12:33] Pirate Russell giggles
[12:33] Pirate Russell: For example, between gay people, terms usually associated with homophobia may be used, such as "faggot" or "lesbo."
[12:33] Pirate Russell: As with all sexual activities, some people have sexual fantasies about humiliation, and others actually undertake it as a lifestyle or in a scene.
[12:33] Pirate Russell: Sexual fantasies relating to mild humiliation are not uncommon.
[12:34] ***BH*** blushes and nods
[12:34] Pirate Russell: Some humiliation roleplay (pup-play and age play in particular) is combined with loyalty and care-giving to the extent that these fetishes can be seen as exercises in trust rather than primarily a humiliation fetish.
[12:34] Pirate Russell: .
[12:34] Pirate Russell: ~ Online Humiliation - Why W/we're here!
[12:34] Pirate Russell: Online humiliation is the desire to be seen in a sexually embarrassing context via the internet. This practice allows the submissive to seek fetish partners from across the world.
[12:34] Pirate Russell: * Common methods of online humiliation include:
[12:34] Pirate Russell: ** Public pillory
[12:34] Pirate Russell: ** Embarrassing photographic or video assignments for submissives
[12:34] Pirate Russell: ** The requirement for submissives to keep online journals, detailing personal information such as masturbation frequency and details
[12:35] Pirate Russell: ** Verbal abuse
[12:35] Pirate Russell: ** Publicly bidding for items that reveal their fetishes
[12:35] Pirate Russell: ** Forcing them to go, or taking them to places where nudity isn't the norm
[12:35] ***KR***: this is all so true
[12:35] Pirate Russell: Is girl naked today, IRL?
[12:35] Pirate Russell: ** Forcing them to service others in public or private.
[12:35] Pirate Russell: ** Leaving them bound in public places, dressed or not.
[12:35] Pirate Russell: Again, the list is endless, it all depends upon what your submissive finds humiliating, embarassing, or degrading.
[12:36] Pirate Russell: All transcripts can be found at http://collegeofkink.blogspot.com
[12:36] Pirate Russell: College of Kink classes Monday 7a, Tuesday & Friday 12:00pm
[12:36] Pirate Russell: Y/you could always check the Search/Events and look for College
[12:36] Pirate Russell: Questions? Comments??
[12:36] ***KR***: Ican not beleive how you have hit upon so much, that seems so true
[12:37] ***DS***: it seems to me like you've covered it all, but i do have a couple questions:
[12:37] Pirate Russell: Knows good crap on the Internet, when I steal it
[12:37] Pirate Russell: go ahead ***DS***!
[12:37] ***DS***: 1 - i believe in trying to look as real as possible
[12:38] ***DS***: i know of slave chores on xstreet, but is there a good brutilizer
[12:38] ***DS***: ??
[12:38] Pirate Russell: Brutalizer?
[12:39] ***DS***: a good face slapper, or degradation HUD
[12:39] Pirate Russell: Ahh, that I don't know
[12:39] Pirate Russell: I have this chair
[12:39] ***DS***: ok, 2nd question
[12:39] MadScience Durance Captive Chair v1.0: CISS: This device needs to briefly test its animations: please grant permission for it to animate your avatar.
[12:39] ***BH*** whimpers'
[12:40] ***DS***: where in HOV is a good place for public humiliation?
[12:40] Pirate Russell: Dance floor.
[12:40] Pirate Russell: Front door
[12:40] ***DS***: thanks that what i figured
[12:40] Pirate Russell: ANYplace where there's lots of people. BUT....
[12:40] ***DS***: yes?
[12:40] Pirate Russell: Lots of people = Lots of LAG!
[12:41] ***DS***: yes of course
[12:41] Pirate Russell snaps some cuffs on ***BH***'s wrists
[12:42] Pirate Russell: Have a seat in the wood chair ***BH***
[12:42] ***BH***: yes Mistress
[12:43] ***DS*** takes note of madscience laboratories
[12:43] Pirate Russell locks thecuffs behind her
[12:43] ***BH***'s cuff (r forearm) whispers: ***BH***'s ***BH***'s cuff (r forearm) has been locked by Pirate Russell (Type Lock).
[12:43] ***BH***'s cuff(r lower leg) whispers: Pirate Russell has taken ***BH***'s keys from her ***BH***'s cuff(r lower leg).
[12:43] Pirate's property whispers: Pirate Russell has taken ***BH***'s keys from her Pirate's property.
[12:43] ***KR***: Thank you Mistress Russell
[12:44] Pirate Russell: There's stuff I can do to her in this chair that she won't like....
[12:44] Pirate Russell can slap girl's face
[12:45] ***BH***: OWWWW
[12:45] Pirate Russell: Or her tits....
[12:45] ***BH***: please stop Mistress
[12:46] Pirate Russell: or girl's ass!
[12:46] Pirate Russell: This is just one piece of furnature, there's rpolly Millions of them out there!
[12:46] Pirate Russell: furnIture and Prolly.. too
[12:47] ***DS*** thiinks to himself, "a good item for my collection" and smiles
[12:47] Pirate Russell reaches down and rubs girl's ass
[12:48] ***BH*** moans soft and buries her face in the chair
[12:49] Pirate Russell spreads girl's cheeks, and pushes her legs apart, "And this is good for humiliation, too.... "
[12:51] Pirate Russell thinks we went a place ***KR***din't wanna go
[12:51] ***DS***: ah, dang we lost ***KR***, hmmm, oh well
[12:51] Pirate Russell: Anyway, ***DS***, that's about it... he he
[12:52] ***DS***: thank you again, and thank you ***BH*** this has been an excellent lecture and i'm glad i attended
[12:53] ***BH*** blushes and stammers" Your welcome"
[12:53] ***DS***: just a small gesture to you both for your time and efforts
[12:53] Pirate Russell: NOT necessary, but appreciated
[12:53] ***BH***: thank You
[12:54] ***DS***: i'll be seeing you around and 'till next time, i'll see if i can better hone my skills, i know but it's a small token for this vast knowledge, thanx again
[12:54] ***DS***: toodle loo,
[12:55] ***DS*** similes and waves goodbye
[12:55] Pirate Russell: Okie doke
[12:55] Pirate Russell: ciao for now

Erotic Humiliation - 8/11/09

[12:07] Pirate Russell: OK, those that will, please turn off any radars, MystiTools, etc., to help with the Horrendous lag
[12:08] Pirate Russell: Please take all cross talk to IM, and all collar, etc commands to the secondary channels!
[12:08] Pirate Russell: Welcome to House of V's College of Kink! As most of y'all know, My name is Pirate Russell, Head Mistress of the College, and today's instructor. I have been in SL for 3 1/2 years, a lesbian Domme, the entire time.
[12:08] Pirate Russell: Hiya ***AL***, just geting started!
[12:08] Pirate Russell: For any that need to leave early, all transcripts can be found at http://collegeofkink.blogspot.com
[12:08] ***AL***: hello
[12:09] Pirate Russell: .
[12:09] Pirate Russell: Erotic humiliation: The consensual use of psychological humiliation in a sexual context, whereby, at least, one person gains arousal or erotic excitement from the powerful emotions of being humiliated and demeaned, or of humiliating another;
[12:09] Pirate Russell: often (but not always) in conjunction with sexual stimulation of one or both partners in the activity. The humiliation need not be sexual in itself, as with many other sexual activities it is the feelings derived from it which are sought,
[12:10] Pirate Russell: regardless of the nature of the actual activity.
[12:10] Pirate Russell: Consider that the desire to be beneath the other partner during intercourse,the idea of "getting caught" such as with having sex in the garden or woods, or mild rape fantasies (where the person imagines themselves to be forced in a way they would like,
[12:10] Pirate Russell: and which must be seen as completely different to any real form of rape), are mild emotional games that emphasise status, vulnerability and control.
[12:10] Pirate Russell: However, for most people such ideas remain a fantasy and they would have strong reservations about it being made public, or engaged in with a partner for real, however erotic the idea may be.
[12:11] Pirate Russell: If a person does reveal their fetish to their partners, this usually is a result of a huge amount of trust invested in them, due to the similarly huge psychological struggle they would have had to have gone through to tell them.
[12:11] Pirate Russell: Many people have the worry of being ridiculed for their fetish, and such ridicule from their partners could be psychologically catastrophic.
[12:11] Pirate Russell: Therefore, many people use online humiliation (where the humiliator and others are involved via the internet using chat, websites, SL, etc.) as a compromise between exhibitionism and reality on the one hand, and safety and anonymity on the other.
[12:12] Pirate Russell: Humiliation can be verbal or physical, and can be relatively private or public.
[12:12] Pirate Russell: For ***MS*** here, it's gonna be quite public!
[12:12] Pirate Russell: Often it can become ritualized, and unlike some sexual variations it can also be easily carried out over a long distance or online.
[12:12] Pirate Russell: The distinction between humiliation and dominance in an activity such as erotic spanking is that the sought-after effect is primarily the humiliation; the activity is just a means to that end.
[12:13] Pirate Russell: While mild or moderate humiliation is not an uncommon part of BDSM or other sexual roleplay, humiliation play can be taken to a point where it becomes emotionally or psychologically distressing to one or the other partner.
[12:13] Pirate Russell: Erotic humiliation can become extreme enough to be considered a form of edgeplay, that some consider may best be approached with advance negotiation and use of a safeword.
[12:13] Pirate Russell: This is a highly subjective issue, and depends greatly on the participants.
[12:14] Pirate Russell: .
[12:14] Pirate Russell: ~Humiliation is not the same as dominance, as the devotee is not necessarily seeking to be ordered about.
[12:14] Pirate Russell: Humiliation comes into its own as a sexual force when the devotee seeks the humiliation over and above the means; for example, when being spanked is primarily valued because of the belittlement involved.
[12:14] Pirate Russell reaches under ***MS***s dress and spanks her twice.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: As such, it encompasses a range of paraphilia (abnormal sexual activity), in particular foot fetish or shoe fetish, body worship, spanking, bondage and most BDSM styles.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: It can be as basic as the desire to kiss and massage feet as a precursor to sex, or it can be complex, involving roleplay or public displays of subservience.
[12:15] ***MS*** casts her eyes down, so as not to make eye contact with her friends and blushes profusely at the sudden spanking.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: It can be for a set period of time (a "scene") or as an ongoing facet of a relationship.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: The "humiliation" is not intrinsic to the act or the object. Rather, symbiotic, a relationship beneficial to each charged, by the shared attitude of the partners engaged in the act.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: It is they who invest specific acts, objects or body-parts with a humiliating aspect.
[12:16] Pirate Russell pulls up the front of ***MS***'s skirt, "Like this body part!", then lets the skirt fall back
[12:17] Pirate Russell: .
[12:17] Pirate Russell: ~ Means of Humiliation
[12:17] ***MS*** cries out at the sudden exposer, turning yet a deeper shade of red......
[12:17] Pirate Russell: Sexual humiliation is very open-ended. Broadly, it can be divided into verbal and physical aspects.
[12:17] Pirate Russell: *Verbal aspects of this might include:
[12:17] Pirate Russell: ** Mockery, derision and ridicule.
[12:18] Pirate Russell: ** Verbal belittlement, such as "slave", "boy", "girl", "missy", "pet".
[12:18] Pirate Russell looks over at girl
[12:18] Pirate Russell: ** Insults and verbal abuse, such as "fat", "ugly", "stupid", "worthless".
[12:18] Pirate Russell: ** Degrading references, such as "slut", "tart", "bitch" and "whore".
[12:19] Pirate Russell: ** Slighting of body parts or behaviors, such as disparaging or cruel references to breasts, facial appearance, genitalia or genital size, bottom, and slighting of mannerisms such as walking, responsiveness, standard of self-care.
[12:19] Pirate Russell: ** Having to ask permission for everyday activities such as going to the toilet, spending money or eating.
[12:19] Pirate Russell: ** Small breasts humiliation, where scorn is addressed over the supposed inadequacy of the adult female's breasts, or her inability to please a man (and by implication her essential worthlessness as a woman), and her breasts become objects of fun.
[12:20] Pirate Russell looks over at girl, "Nope, no small breast humiliation here! he he
[12:20] Pirate Russell: ** Small penis humiliation, where scorn is addressed over the supposed inadequacy of the adult male's genitals, or his inability to please a woman (and by implication his essential worthlessness as a man), and his penis becomes an object of fun.
[12:21] Pirate Russell pulls up the skirt again, "Nope, no small penis humiliation, either!"
[12:21] ***LT***: bad when get a birthday cake your old and have a small penis
[12:21] Pirate Russell: ** Forced repetition, such as being obliged to repeat back commands to confirm them.
[12:21] ***MS*** is glad she doesn't have a small penise she didn't know about.
[12:22] Pirate Russell lets the skirt back down again
[12:22] Pirate Russell: ** Forced flattery, such as agreeing that every decision that the dominant makes is wise, correct, and justifiable, while additionally praising the dominant's physical and personality traits.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: ** Reduction to Human animal roleplay or human pet, referring to these individuals as pet, dog, girl, bitch, or making them eat and drink from pet food and water bowls.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: or cows?!
[12:22] ***ES*** moos!
[12:22] ***LT***: ears perk up
[12:23] ***CT*** moos!
[12:23] Pirate Russell: .
[12:23] Pirate Russell: *Physical Humiliation:
[12:23] Pirate Russell: Some sexual humiliation involves inflicting pain, but much of it is far more concerned with ridicule, mocking, degradation and embarrassment.
[12:23] ***LT***: only when she is hooked to the milk machine
[12:23] ***AL***: ***ES*** your not a cow
[12:23] ***ES*** moos!
[12:23] Pirate Russell: ((Cross talk to IM, please!))
[12:23] Pirate Russell: Physical and tangible aspects might include:
[12:23] Pirate Russell: ** Wearing of external signs of "ownership", such as a collar.
[12:24] Pirate Russell: ** Forced to wear a gag and/or restraints on the body.
[12:24] Pirate Russell: ** Prohibitions or restrictions on clothing, even in public. For females a common example is being mandated to only wear revealing bikinis or lingerie. For men, this may include feminizing or cross-dressing.
[12:24] Pirate Russell pulls ***MS***s dress over her head dropping it to the floor
[12:24] Pirate Russell: Both sexes may be expected to go completely nude, with decorative objects such as collars, bands, tiaras, or cuffs being the only exceptions.
[12:25] Pirate Russell: ** Having friends, family or strangers aware of or witnessing one's treatment (i.e.: public humiliation).
[12:26] Pirate Russell looks at the friends that ***MS*** wouldn't look at earlier
[12:26] Pirate Russell: ** Use of chastity belts or other means of erotic sexual denial.
[12:26] Pirate Russell: ** Suppressed freedom of movement. This may include never being able to leave the room in which the dominant is present without permission, and may be forbidden to leave the house or 'dungeon' in general for the duration of slavery or servitude.
[12:26] ***SB***t: ^^ perks up at chastity belt
[12:26] Pirate Russell: ** Frequent performance of passive-aggressive sexual services for the dominant, such as erotic massage, cunnilingus, analingus, or fellatio, without expectations of reciprocal acts or intercourse.
[12:27] Pirate Russell: ** Specific rituals and affectations to be adopted. This includes displays of subservience, such as, walking a pace behind the dominant, only speaking when spoken to, kneeling or prostrating in front of the dominant when expecting orders,
[12:27] ***MS*** struggles to keep her hands at her side, feeling utterly exposed.
[12:28] Pirate Russell: eating only after others or on the floor, low status place to sleep, and a wide variety of body worship activities such as kissing and/or licking the dominant's feet, boots, buttocks, anus, vulva etc. to express acknowledgment, subservience, shame, or eve
[12:28] Pirate Russell: ** Spanking, whipping, restraint or other BDSM activities such as cock and ball torture (CBT).
[12:29] Pirate Russell: ** Performance of menial tasks or abusive workload, such as cleaning the floors with a toothbrush.
[12:29] Pirate Russell picks up the dress, keeping it from girl, "That will be all ***MS***."
[12:29] Pirate Russell: girl may sit
[12:29] ***MS*** sighs. Thank you.
[12:29] Pirate Russell: ** Detailed punishments for a variety of 'infractions' or misbehavior, such as having to stand in a corner facing a wall for several hours, flogging or whipping, reduced rations, or forced exercise.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: ** Roleplaying "lower status" beings, such as animals (for example dog or horse) or babies (see human animal roleplay, pup-play and adult baby play).
[12:30] Pirate Russell: Or Cow-play
[12:30] Pirate Russell: ** Ejaculating, farting, defecating, spitting, slapping or urinating on the bottom's body, especially the face.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: ** Erotic objectification, where the bottom is cast in the role of an object, such as a footstool.
[12:31] Pirate Russell: ** Cuckoldry, taking on a third party lover to humiliate the bottom as an expression of the relationship between the top and the bottom.
[12:31] Pirate Russell: ** Having to ask permission to orgasm during sex or masturbation.
[12:31] Pirate Russell: The list is virtually endless, it all depends on what the bottom DOESN'T LIKE!
[12:32] Pirate Russell: Sexual roleplaying may or may not involve humiliation. For example, one person might play the part of a dog because they enjoy being mock-forced into it, and the top will emphasize the lowness of the bottom's status as an animal.
[12:32] Pirate Russell: Whereas another person might play the role of the dog without any element of humiliation, simply as an expression of their inner animal or playful spirit.
[12:33] Pirate Russell: .
[12:33] Pirate Russell: ~ Psychology of Humiliation
[12:33] Pirate Russell: Humiliation in general touches strong emotional buttons, the more so when it becomes sexualized.
[12:33] Pirate Russell: Because of this, consent and (paradoxically) a high degree of awareness and communication is needed to ensure that the result is desirable, rather than abusive.
[12:33] Pirate Russell: For example, a submissive may enjoy being insulted in some ways, but be genuinely crushed and devastated if humiliated or insulted in other ways.
[12:34] Pirate Russell: Humiliation play is also connected to sexual fetishism, in that non-sexual activities may become sexualized by association with arousal,
[12:34] Pirate Russell: and also may be associated with exhibitionism in the sense of wanting others to witness (or being aroused by others witnessing) one's sexual degradation.
[12:34] Pirate Russell: For some people, activities such as name-calling are a way of achieving ego reduction or getting over sexual inhibitions.
[12:35] Pirate Russell: For example, between gay people, terms usually associated with homophobia may be used, such as "faggot" or "lesbo."
[12:35] Pirate Russell: As with all sexual activities, some people have sexual fantasies about humiliation, and others actually undertake it as a lifestyle or in a scene.
[12:35] Pirate Russell: Sexual fantasies relating to mild humiliation are not uncommon.
[12:36] Pirate Russell: Some humiliation roleplay (pup-play and age play in particular) is combined with loyalty and care-giving to the extent that these fetishes can be seen as exercises in trust rather than primarily a humiliation fetish.
[12:36] Pirate Russell: .
[12:36] Pirate Russell: ~ Online Humiliation - Why W/we're here!
[12:36] Pirate Russell: Online humiliation is the desire to be seen in a sexually embarrassing context via the internet. This practice allows the submissive to seek fetish partners from across the world.
[12:37] Pirate Russell: * Common methods of online humiliation include:
[12:37] Pirate Russell: ** Public pillory
[12:37] Pirate Russell: ** Embarrassing photographic or video assignments for submissives
[12:37] Pirate Russell: ** The requirement for submissives to keep online journals, detailing personal information such as masturbation frequency and details
[12:38] Pirate Russell: ** Verbal abuse
[12:38] Pirate Russell: ** Publicly bidding for items that reveal their fetishes
[12:38] Pirate Russell: ** Forcing them to go, or taking them to places where nudity isn't the norm
[12:38] Pirate Russell: ** Forcing them to service others in public or private.
[12:38] Pirate Russell: ** Leaving them bound in public places, dressed or not.
[12:38] Pirate Russell: Again, the list is endless, it all depends upon what your submissive finds humiliating, embarassing, or degrading.
[12:39] Pirate Russell: All transcripts can be found at http://collegeofkink.blogspot.com
[12:39] Pirate Russell: College of Kink classes Monday 7a, Tuesday & Friday 12:00pm
[12:39] Pirate Russell: Y/you could always check the Search/Events and look for College
[12:39] Pirate Russell: Questions? Comments??
[12:39] Pirate Russell: SpeakEasy HUD detaching...
[12:40] Pirate Russell: Nothing, huh?
[12:42] Pirate Russell: Going once.......
[12:42] Pirate Russell: .............................Going twice............
[12:42] Pirate Russell: .........................................................Gone!
[12:42] Pirate Russell: Class dismissed
[12:43] ***SB***t: thanks Pirate
[12:43] ***ES*** moos!
[12:43] ***MS***: Thank you.
[12:43] Pirate Russell: NOW ya got comments! :sighs
[12:43] ***SB***t claps hands together and looks around for some mischief to get into
[12:43] Pirate Russell: ***AL***, stay behind please
[12:43] Pirate Russell tosses the dress to ***MS***
[12:43] ***MS***: Thank you for my dress.
[12:43] ***SB***t: Uh oh ***AL*** is in Ttttttttrouble.
[12:43] Pirate Russell: Sure
[12:44] ***LT***: interesting subject thanks for class pirate
[12:44] ***AL***: hehe
[12:44] ***AL***: i am so not
[12:44] ***ES***: ***AL*** is trouble.
[12:44] ***AL***: hush ***ES***
[12:44] ***AL***: i am only a good girl always
[12:44] ***AL***: mostly
[12:44] Pirate Russell: Not interesting enough for any discussion, though.
[12:44] ***SB***t snaps gum and thinks, I wonder what Principal Pirates office looks like
[12:45] ***ES*** is the only innocent one in the whole bunch.
[12:45] Pirate Russell: Oh, well. Guess that's My fault

The Collar: History and Symbolism 8/10/09

[07:02] Zealot Benmergui: OK, we will give latecomers a few minutes, then after that, we go up and pillage their villages and steal their women
[07:02] ***SW***: Remember it's pillage THEN burn
[07:02] ***vP***: lol
[07:03] Zealot Benmergui writes that on a post it note
[07:04] ***MS*** giggles. So we shoot now, ask ***pQ***ons later?
[07:05] Zealot Benmergui: Absolutely
[07:06] Zealot Benmergui: OK, if everyone could find seats, or the closest equivilant, we can get started in a moment
[07:08] Zealot Benmergui: OK, lets go ahead and get started...lots to cover, ann then we have group sex afterwards
[07:08] Zealot Benmergui: Welcome A/all to the House of V’s College of Kink. My name is Zealot Benmergui, Baron BardHaven and I will be your host today. Some of you may know me from lecturing here at House of V and other locations around the grid. Others of you may know me from my recent book tour, autographing copies of my most recent autobiography, “The DaVinci Cock – The harrowing almost-true life story of an undercover transvestite metrosexual sodomite in Vatican City and the Pope who loved him.”
[07:10] Zealot Benmergui: The topic for today is The Collar: History and Symbolism and we will be looking a little bit at the tradition of collaring, what it means and what it doesn’t mean in a D/s relationship. Please note that for the purpose of clarity, I will tend to use “she” to refer to a submissive and “he” to refer to a Dominant, but either can be of any gender. Your humble lecturer WILL accept tips, but they must be paid to me directly, if you are so inclined, thank you.
[07:11] Zealot Benmergui: Historically, collars have been used to denote slavery in its myriad forms since before the age of Rome, and in fact many museums from around the world have excellent examples of them on display…unscripted of course, and few if any have things like Lord MongrelCock’s Naughty Little Taxbreak inscribed on them. The term Collar was originally Latin, Collare, which became ***CF***r in Middle English in the 14th Century.
[07:11] Zealot Benmergui: A later related term, Coffle, was coined in the 1700s for a series of Collars connected in a chain. Not to be confused of course with a Quaffle Coffle, which is a series of six Hogwort’s students being fucking on broomsticks.
[07:12] Zealot Benmergui: Or fucked BY broomsticks, Rowling was never clear and anyway, she was distracted trying to find her panties
[07:12] ***pQ*** giggles at the sudden visual
[07:13] Zealot Benmergui: In reality Coffles and the Collars we have discussed thus far were all used by the formal slave trade, which usually involved brutal labor and rapid death…and not many sets of silks or orgasms. However, there IS a historical precedence for the collar as a symbol of a person being owned sexually or controlled by another, just as there is historical precedence for certain subs being Slut Toys.
[07:13] Zealot Benmergui: The collar, in the context most of you likely see it in, as a neckpiece of leather, metal or both designed to be used both as a restraint and a symbol of slavery or submission, actually comes down to us mainly from literature and entertainment, especially the large metal forms covered in D rings.
[07:14] Zealot Benmergui: or other spikey bits
[07:14] Zealot Benmergui: For one thing, in historic practice large metal collars tended to be unworkable for daily use (except in transport) for most real slaves as they tended to get in the way and cause potentially fatal neck ulcerations, despite what we may see in old Steve Reeves movies. Same with all that baby oil. Just didn’t happen much on the road from Kush to Ninevah. If you expect the collar to flat out kill your sub, you are one tough assed Dominant indeed.
[07:15] Zealot Benmergui: The first solid source of modern collar imagery comes from what I feel is the Ur-text of modern D/s (ignore the awful movie version), Histoire d'O or The Story of O, written by Dominique Aury
[07:15] Zealot Benmergui: aka Pauline Réage
[07:16] Zealot Benmergui: aka Anne Desclos.
[07:16] Zealot Benmergui: Apparently to write smut in the 50s, you needed LOTS of names. It was published in French in 1955, and the author was brought up on obscenity charges, which were eventually dismissed. It was critically acclaimed in France, much like Jerry Lewis, but not published in English until 1965.
[07:17] ***SS***: Z, I brought a friend, ***CF***
[07:17] Zealot Benmergui: Fortunetly however, it was availkable int he french version in England, so school boys were able to improve there french verbs while jerking off.
[07:17] ***CF*** chuckles
[07:18] ***SS***: Wow, I missed a lot
[07:18] Zealot Benmergui: Welcome...have a seat...we just got to the schoolboys jerking off point....so you're in luck
[07:18] ***CF***: lol
[07:18] ***vP***: loool
[07:18] ***SS***: woopsie
[07:18] Zealot Benmergui: I won’t go into the plot here, and if you haven’t read it you should or watch the cartoon version every Saturday morning on ABC this season…but it brought the concept of sexual domination into the modern consciousness. That book made the collar, and BDSM in general, an established “kink”, both in porn and popular understanding. It was now something bad girls did. Classy, arty bad girls. The best kind.
[07:19] Zealot Benmergui: In no small part we owe modern BDSM and D/s to The Story of O...both the best and most beautiful parts and the somewhat brutal silly parts as well.
[07:19] ***XF***: i have read that good book
[07:19] Zealot Benmergui: Beyond The Story of O, modern collars also owe major debts to Norman’s Gor books, begun in the 1960s, and the gay leather movement of the 70s which was looking for a dramatic, visceral symbol of the master/slave dynamic. Both were major parts of promoting collars as a modern day sex toy and also made them infamous in mainstream culture, porn and in junior high school bathrooms worldwide.
[07:20] Zealot Benmergui: Sources like that connected to what both we in the lifestyle and the mainstream envision when we discuss a BDSM collar, but not really to what they mean in modern D/s relationships. D/s as a lifestyle is far more diverse now then was ever imagined in Gor or Roissey and encompasses lots of different personalities, goals and fetishes. Of course, there are people who are involved in Gorean relationships or strict power exchange as was part of Story of O, but the majority of people are involved in Chinese Menu style D/s…one from Column A, two from Column B. Therefore, the meaning and significance of collars can vary.
[07:21] Zealot Benmergui: Not to mention LOTS of Fortune Cookies
[07:22] ***SS***: but in O, it was her will to please Rene, and then Stephen more than it was her choice to give herself to one, or many in her case
[07:22] Zealot Benmergui: To people who are just involved in BDSM as a sexual kink, likely amongst many kinks they enjoy, a collar is just a toy used to hold someone in place. To someone involved in Domination and submission, a collar is a symbol of commitment or a statement of being part of the D/s lifestyle, to a Mistress and slave, it is ownership…for some, it is all three or any combination thereof...or like, just a really bitchin’ choker.
[07:22] Zealot Benmergui: Nods...things have developed since O...but the basic language that we use tends to derive from O
[07:22] ***PM*** chuckles at the analogy
[07:23] ***SS***: and it was a ring for her once the "initiation was completed, and of course the brand"
[07:23] Zealot Benmergui: nods....both of which have been mainly lost....some people do use rings in rl, a few even brands
[07:24] ***SS***: isn't that what a wedding band is?
[07:24] ***SS*** giggles
[07:24] Zealot Benmergui: but the Collar has become the cominant symbol..mainly because it is more unusal and sexy...and doesn;t involve burning flesh
[07:24] ***CF***: lol
[07:24] Zealot Benmergui: *domiant
[07:24] Zealot Benmergui: *dominant
[07:24] ***pQ*** is all for avoiding burning flesh
[07:24] Zealot Benmergui: there, damn it
[07:24] ***XF***: no thats the tird ring of marriage - suffering lmao
[07:24] ***vP***: lol
[07:24] ***PM*** rubs Phe's thigh and grins
[07:24] Zealot Benmergui: and we will get to weeding rings in a minute, darling ***SS***
[07:24] ***SS***: they also use the alternative of Tattooing now
[07:25] ***vP***: ouch
[07:25] ***pQ*** considers needles and thinks maybe burning won't be so bad
[07:25] Zealot Benmergui: wedding..sorry folds, these are loaner hands, my own were hacked off by rabid weasals last night at a basketball game
[07:25] ***CF***: lol
[07:26] ***CF***: When will the government do something about the rabid weasel menace?
[07:26] Zealot Benmergui: Tattoos are also tricky, since what do you do if the relationship goes bad, or you marry someone later on who doesn;t nessacerily want your thigh to say LordNoxious' Fucktoy
[07:26] ***SS*** giggles
[07:26] Zealot Benmergui: or what if you become a nun?
[07:26] ***XF*** whispers: long pants???
[07:26] ***vP***: ahahahaa
[07:26] ***pQ***: whiteout?
[07:26] Zealot Benmergui: most convents actually require sisters to be in the nude once the doors are closed
[07:26] ***SS***: then you are enslaved to god, and the house of religion all the priests that aren't gay
[07:27] ***SS***: did I say that out loud?
[07:27] ***XF***: what????
[07:27] Zealot Benmergui: so you change the tattoo to read Jesus' Fucktoy?
[07:27] ***XF***: lmfaoi
[07:27] ***SS***: ooo mhmm
[07:27] ***vP***: is a catholic believes what Popes says...
[07:27] Zealot Benmergui: last thing I heard a Pope say was "No teeth, just lips, ya punta"
[07:28] ***vP***: right:P
[07:28] ***SS*** chuckles
[07:28] Zealot Benmergui: anyway, now that I have valiated my ticket to hell again, going on
[07:28] ***vP***: i ll use lips next time i promise:P
[07:28] ***XF***: omg
[07:28] ***XF***: lmfao roflmfao
[07:28] ***SS***: if I may Z
[07:28] Zealot Benmergui: please Seera dear
[07:28] Zealot Benmergui holds out his ticket
[07:29] ***SS***: the symbolisim, of a D/s relationship, is what the two put into it, what they believe it to be, some insist on a collar, ring, or brand... tattoo...
[07:29] ***XF***: well atleast it was just a ticket
[07:29] Zealot Benmergui: nods....exactly, which we will be coming to
[07:29] ***vP***: give her your ticket:P
[07:30] Zealot Benmergui: In Second Life and through the online BDSM community the Collar tends to take on even greater significance. With the lack of direct physical contact, and often limited time, symbols such as collars can become a vital lifeline and connection between Dominant and submissive. They can become a reminder of an often tenuous and hard to define relationship. In addition, certain collars may have certain roles.
[07:30] ***XF***: ticket for the spot he is in i think he was trying to be polite
[07:31] ***SS***: others it's the inner devotion of what they believe, most of the realism of the commitment is with the women, and how they feel... personally, I believe in devotion, honor, and dedication towards him....no ring, brand, collar, or anything else will bring that to anyone
[07:31] ***vP***: raises her hand...
[07:31] Zealot Benmergui: Polite, since when...I thought she could validate it for me...kerPUNCH
[07:31] Zealot Benmergui: Yes ***vP***dear
[07:31] ***vP***: about collars... isnt it a way to tell to other... stay away this one belongs to me?
[07:31] Zealot Benmergui: Some use it that way, certainly
[07:32] ***vP***: this is what i saw from most of Masters in here
[07:32] ***SS***: do collars always look, like they do here?
[07:32] ***XF***: no there a tad more realistic i rl
[07:32] ***SS***: some subs, slaves are not "retricted" not even in real
[07:32] Zealot Benmergui: Some women also wear dummy collars to dissuade trolls, Doms who climb into their IM box with "KNEEL SLUT FOR I AM MORGOTH THE UNSHRIVEN AND I WANT SOME POONTANG
[07:32] ***SS***: See that is another thing
[07:32] ***vP***: ouch
[07:33] ***CF***: I think it's more effective to have the sub's heart tell the others to stay away. ;)
[07:33] ***vP***: so fuckin right
[07:33] ***SS***: I had someone speak to me, wnating something
[07:33] ***SS***: it is my right, and will, to say yes or no
[07:33] ***XF***: omfg
[07:33] ***SS***: so I said no
[07:33] ***SS***: cause I can
[07:33] ***SS***: so many think, a collar means weakness
[07:34] ***CF***: Takes a lot of inner strength to kneel, it should be respected.
[07:34] ***SS***: it means a woman is "allowing" herself to be what she wants to be, the level of comfort, she desires"
[07:34] ***PM***: If it is a true Master with a true connection the sub will want to kneel and obey, otherwise it is only words
[07:34] ***vP***: agrees
[07:34] ***XF***: so wh ya collar???
[07:34] ***SS***: Pakur... does that also mean you are always called Master?
[07:34] Zealot Benmergui: smiles
[07:35] ***PM***: when I rp in Gor yes
[07:35] ***SS***: or Sir from every slave?
[07:35] ***SS***: Gor, "spits"
[07:35] ***PM***: otherwise it depends
[07:35] ***PM***: you don't have to agree with me my dear
[07:35] ***vP***: someone yeled on me cause i didnt call him Sir at HoV...
[07:35] ***SS***: I don't
[07:35] ***SS*** smiles
[07:35] ***PM***: but you are being rather rude
[07:35] Zealot Benmergui: OK, lets slow down for a second..all of this is excellent, but lets get through some more points first
[07:35] Zealot Benmergui: especially before we all start spitting
[07:35] ***vP***: lol
[07:35] ***SS***: I did already, sorry Z
[07:36] Zealot Benmergui: s'ok...you looked good doing it
[07:36] Zealot Benmergui: going on...
[07:36] Zealot Benmergui: There are such things as Collars of Consideration which some people use when thinking if a relationship suits both parties, or a Collar of Training for a learning situation. There is also a Collar of Protection, which some subs use mainly to hold off other Dominants offering them collars, or banging them on the head with virtual clubs and forcing them on them if they are in a bad Gorean RP. Finally, a Formal Collar is usually considered to be a permanent expression of submission or slavery.
[07:36] Zealot Benmergui: As ***SS*** rightly noted, Collars are not required equipment. Many D/s relations do not involve a public collar at all, depending on mutual agreement and acceptance of the Dom/sub relationship without requiring such public statements. Each relationship varies, but the Collar is almost always a major symbol, for better or worse.
[07:37] Zealot Benmergui: To all who wear one, or give one, a collar is a potent and powerful symbol of possession, or commitment, or pleasure…or even of personal preference or style. In the end, that symbol can be anything, not just a neck piece. Collars tend to be easiest however since they are more or less accepted as the de facto BDSM relationship symbol, like a kinky wedding ring. Some people opt also to use a real world counterpart for the Sl collar, be it an actual collar or another piece of jewelry.
[07:38] Zealot Benmergui: Therefore, the nature of a collar is highly individual, changing depending on the people involved, and the nature of their relationship. There is no RIGHT or WRONG collar. What works for one person may be anathema to another and what turns one girl on may turn another off, and cause yet a third to contact the FBI. However, I have a few thoughts on what characteristics make for a successful collaring, and which to avoid.
[07:40] Zealot Benmergui: First of all, a Collar (or the agreement behind one) should be a serious step in a relationship, whatever the relationship. It should be given only after a great deal of contemplation and thought and much discussion. ..and never until things are quite certain and well understood. When a formal collar is offered and accepted, there should be no surprises or secrets if possible…it is the end of one phase of a relationship and the beginning of a new one. We have all seen the chaos caused by collars given too casually, and then removed too easily. Such behavior undermines the entire structure of D/s in that it cheapens something which many hold to be sacred. The term Velcro Collar is now generally accepted, and hated in D/s like Brussels sprouts at the day care center. Think of such a collar as getting married three times, in a week.
[07:40] Zealot Benmergui: To the same person.
[07:41] Zealot Benmergui: Secondly, a collar should not be given quickly. I know we are all brought up on the concept of whirlwind courtships and getting swept off our feet…but in practical terms getting swept off your feet means you are about to fall down the stairs. Falling hard for someone is a great excuse to spend the weekend lashed to the couch getting your brains fucked out…not a good reason to accept a collar.
[07:42] Zealot Benmergui: Again, think of a collar like a wedding ring, and remember what we are taught by television about accepting sudden proposals in a wave of excitement. You will soon either be an alibi, or a plot device after asking “Honey, what is this big blood soaked mailbag doing in the back of your boat?” or “Why no, I have never thought about bearing Satan’s child, why?”
[07:42] Zealot Benmergui: Lastly, both parties should be sure what it means to them, and what it means to the other person involved. I have seen too many couples torn apart because one expected a collar to mean something the other wouldn’t have even thought of. Symbols are great, as long as they mean the same to all involved…otherwise what is supposed to give unity and security will just sow confusion and pain, and not the GOOD kinds of confusion and pain
[07:43] Zealot Benmergui: Collars are often spoken of by submissives as their starry eyed goal, the way some people in real-life crave a white picket fence or Megan Fox covered in cocoa powder. One should never lose sight of the fact that a collar should be an expression of a mature, full relationship between a Dom and a sub, not as a replacement for the same.
[07:43] Zealot Benmergui: Now then, lets go back to some of the points that were being raised...
[07:44] Zealot Benmergui: mainly of the fact that a Collar is something that SYMBOLIZES a relationship...some people use them, some don;t
[07:44] Zealot Benmergui: I have given two collars in SL over 4 years....
[07:44] ***vP***: speachless for the first time...
[07:44] Zealot Benmergui: but have been Dominant in many relationship that had no need for such formal symbols
[07:45] Zealot Benmergui: Collars are often seen as a way to mark someone, perhaps make clear that no one else is to be with them or play with them...
[07:46] Zealot Benmergui: so Collars are more often found in Exclusive or semi-exclusive relationships...it doesn;t mean the emotions involved in other relationships are less valid, just less in need of a physical symbol
[07:46] Zealot Benmergui: And of course, collars take on different meanings depending on the community
[07:47] Zealot Benmergui: in Gor, a colar means something different then they do here at House of V, for example
[07:47] Zealot Benmergui: How many of you have actually worn a collar online?
[07:47] Zealot Benmergui: or given one
[07:48] ***pQ***: has worn three, and one of consideration, in two years
[07:48] Zealot Benmergui: What did they mean to you?
[07:49] ***CF***: It was an outward expression of an inward reality. It's a symbol - not to mention, the easiest way to get the animations in one place.
[07:49] ***pQ***: a commitment beyond the level of casual relationship ... i have worn them in and out of Gor... the meaning changes with the relationship. love, commitment, ownership, obedience... many things
[07:50] Zealot Benmergui: nods..would you say each one was different?
[07:50] ***pQ***: as individual as the people involved in the relationship
[07:50] ***pQ***: and as unique as their relationship
[07:51] ***CF*** smiles
[07:51] Zealot Benmergui: nods..exactly...Collars can mean vastly different things depoending on what we wish them to
[07:51] ***vP***: worn someones collar only for 3 days and now i have my own for personal reasons
[07:51] Zealot Benmergui: People tend to ASSUME a collar has one or two meanings..depending on their views on BDSM
[07:51] Zealot Benmergui: nods...you have one to wear when you feel that NOT being collared will make you stand ou, or put you under pressure?
[07:52] ***vP***: its more for protection and rp
[07:52] Zealot Benmergui: nods
[07:52] ***vP***: i always have it but invisible
[07:52] Zealot Benmergui: the same sort of concept...and such dummy collars are actually quite common
[07:52] ***pQ***: being an uncollared sub is very stressful... in Gor impossible, but even out of it, hard
[07:53] ***vP***: exactly
[07:53] Zealot Benmergui: Well, it opens you to the normal concept..So if you are submissive, you will fuck any body who calls you names right?
[07:53] ***vP***: i have more than 5 offers per day to be collared by someone i dont even know
[07:53] ***vP***: of course not
[07:54] ***pQ***: chuckles thinking of the last time someone took that approach
[07:54] Zealot Benmergui: People, even in the lifestyle, often assume an uncollared sub is an AVAILABLE sub
[07:54] ***vP***: nods
[07:54] Zealot Benmergui: or that they spend their nights praying for some guy in a bad hair style and chaps to come along, collar them, and then ignore them while they play WoW
[07:54] ***vP***: but as i can see... wearing a collar doesnt work at the end
[07:55] ***CF*** chuckles
[07:55] Zealot Benmergui: how so, vita?
[07:56] ***zA***: no it do not ***vP***i know some would take it off and put there on in gor
[07:56] ***vP***: theyuse to read profiles you have to wear collar write there that you have a master
[07:56] ***vP***: or they touches my collar to see who is my master
[07:56] Zealot Benmergui: you need to make a line in your minds between D/s and Gor
[07:57] ***vP***: most of the times i have to be rude or bratt or... bitch to avoid them
[07:57] Zealot Benmergui: Gor is a seperate animal and deserves it;s own attention
[07:57] Zealot Benmergui: smiles at vita...Yes, planty of people who come to D/s sims are complete asshats and very rude
[07:57] ***SW*** raising a hand to ask a ***pQ***on, showing my ignorance proudly
[07:57] Zealot Benmergui: and no collar will stop them
[07:58] ***vP***: smiles shilly
[07:58] Zealot Benmergui: not even putting in your profile that you are exclusive protpery of yoru Master who is a former professional wrestler currently working on training Bolivian hit squads to be tougher
[07:58] ***DM***: and to me those arent true doms...they have no honor or repsect
[07:59] ***vP***: laughts
[07:59] ***pQ***: predators
[07:59] Zealot Benmergui: end story
[07:59] Zealot Benmergui: they want to get laid....
[07:59] ***DM***: lol
[07:59] ***vP***: so i ll be bitch and bratt for life time
[07:59] Zealot Benmergui: and at this point, BDSM is mainstream sexuality in SL
[07:59] ***DM***: sad but true
[07:59] ***vP***: waits for Sean's ***pQ***on...
[08:00] Zealot Benmergui: No, you will have to stand up for your rights and self whther you are sub or Dom, gay or straight, partnered or free....that;s life, vita
[08:00] ***XF***: yes witing
[08:00] ***CF***: No doubt you'll be called a bitch by many a moron whose only dominant stroke is the word "Master" over his name.
[08:00] ***DM*** agrees with Sir ***CF***
[08:00] ***SW***: In SL, are collars not more ... I hesitate to use the word "dangerous", but open to abuse? Or does the wearer have SOME degree of control over them?
[08:00] Zealot Benmergui: often several masters above their name
[08:00] ***vP***: i can live with it Sir ***CF***:)
[08:00] ***DM***: or be made to ***pQ***on Your submissiveness
[08:01] Zealot Benmergui: Master Dominant Masterly Masterguy
[08:01] ***pQ***: laughs
[08:01] ***DM***: superdupermaster
[08:01] ***CF***: lmao
[08:01] ***SW***: Master of Masters
[08:01] ***XF***: where is peoples capital for the M
[08:01] ***XF***: lmao
[08:01] ***vP***: thegreatfuckermaster
[08:01] ***DM*** is a superdupersub lol
[08:01] ***CF***: Fantastic ***pQ***on, Sean
[08:02] ***vP***: and i am wonderwoman Di ahahahaha
[08:02] ***DM***: lol
[08:02] Zealot Benmergui: I have enough trouble remember to capitilize my own name, I don;t worry about any one elses
[08:02] ***DM***: :P
[08:02] ***XF***: giggles
[08:02] Zealot Benmergui: OK, this is unique to Sl Sean
[08:02] Zealot Benmergui: the concept of scripts
[08:02] ***DM*** waits for the answer to Sir Seans ***pQ***on
[08:02] Zealot Benmergui: most collars have a whole bunch of scripts running that do all sorts of things
[08:02] ***XF***: yes very intrigued??
[08:02] ***pQ***: rlv
[08:03] Zealot Benmergui: can anyone just claim control? No, not if you set it right
[08:03] Zealot Benmergui: but most collars also come with features that some people use..I find them distasteful
[08:03] ***XF***: what ?? do you mean set it right?
[08:03] ***vP***: offers a collar to Sir Sean:D
[08:03] ***DM***: pointless thing that rlv....to me anyway
[08:03] Zealot Benmergui: such as logging your subs activities or IMs or being able to know where they are at all times
[08:03] ***pQ***: very easy to be abused, using it, in the wrong hands
[08:04] Zealot Benmergui: if I need that kind of information from a spy script, then why am I with the woman to begin with?
[08:04] ***DM***: submission shouldnt have to be monitored...its a gift given freely
[08:04] ***vP***: right
[08:04] ***CF***: Spot on, Z
[08:04] ***DM*** agrees
[08:04] ***SW***: So a person wearing a collar isn't saying "Come and get me" to all around him/her?
[08:04] ***vP***: i just collared Sr Sean looool
[08:04] Zealot Benmergui: By set it right, all collars can be set to either respond to no one but the wearer, to people on a list of Woners, or to anyone who clicks it
[08:04] ***DM***: no Sir Sean
[08:04] ***MS***: /raises her hand to make a comment.
[08:04] ***vP***: nope Sir
[08:04] Zealot Benmergui: yess Miss***MS***
[08:05] ***SW***: Thank you vita
[08:05] ***vP***: a girl wears collar says dont touch me you gonna lose a hand
[08:05] ***CF***: Usually quite the opposite, Sean.
[08:05] ***MS***: Well, I know some subs like to be controlled in that way. My friend who is collared likes to feel that they are controlled. RLV helps to show that for her.
[08:05] Zealot Benmergui: though Sean, some people SEE a collar as a statement of submission, meaning they must like it when you IM them with "Give me a blowjob!"
[08:06] ***MS***: Whether it be blocking her ims, not letting her TP or what have you. It's a thrilling thing for her.
[08:06] Zealot Benmergui: nods...very true Miss***MS***...RLV stands for Restrained Life Viewer...and it is usually not about a collar
[08:06] Zealot Benmergui: but a Mars ring
[08:06] ***vP***: its up to her i guess...
[08:06] ***DM***: true ***MS***, and thats different..im not saying for everyone..im saying for some...like me...
[08:06] Zealot Benmergui: and yes, some women find that level of filtering very comforting
[08:06] ***pQ***: i like the forcesit and forcestrip features of it, because then i don't know what is coming, i can be pushed against the wall without ((get on the pink ball)) or stripped unexpectedly
[08:07] ***CF***: But notice... that's a submissive's preference, she likes to be controlled in such a way. To have that thrust on you when it's not your cup of tea would be... stressful.
[08:07] Zealot Benmergui: remember, to a great degree all of D/s is about gaining more control over your life...as odd as that sounds
[08:07] Zealot Benmergui: a normal person can;t control who tells them what to do, life does that...
[08:07] Zealot Benmergui: a sub can GIVE that ability to one person
[08:07] Zealot Benmergui: or several people...but they are not just a pawn of fate
[08:08] Zealot Benmergui: they are CHOOSING who they submit to
[08:08] ***DM*** smiles
[08:08] ***vP***: nods
[08:08] Zealot Benmergui: since face it, in life, we all submit to someone
[08:08] ***CF*** nods
[08:08] Zealot Benmergui: all that matters is who is the fucker and who is the fuckee
[08:08] ***DM***: i submit to SL and the lindens all the time lol
[08:08] ***vP***: omg Di lol
[08:08] Zealot Benmergui: don;t we all
[08:08] ***CF*** chuckles
[08:09] Zealot Benmergui: and they have yet to even tell me they love me
[08:09] ***DM***: mean arent they? lol
[08:09] Zealot Benmergui wipes a little Linden cum off his chin
[08:09] ***DM***: lmao
[08:09] ***vP***: lol
[08:09] ***pQ***: waits for the lightning bolt
[08:09] ***CF***: Aww, rolling restarts in the middle of my 1500 prim build... Give it to me, big daddy linden. :)
[08:10] ***vP***: 1500 prim?
[08:10] ***CF*** chuckles
[08:10] ***vP***: Sir ***CF*** i do accept:P
[08:10] ***CF***: At one point, yes. ;)
[08:10] Zealot Benmergui: It is essential to remember that each person's collar means something to them, something unique..and their lack of one may ALSO mean something...or it just may mean they can;t edit the fucker
[08:10] ***SW*** laughs
[08:10] ***DM***: OMG lmao
[08:10] ***DM***: yea taht it..i cant edit the fucker...yea yea thats the ticket
[08:11] ***SS***: mhmm
[08:11] ***DM*** winks at ***SS***
[08:11] ***vP***: omg its 6 o clock...
[08:11] Zealot Benmergui: My Master owns it, y'know, and he is like, gone fishing in Nebraska, so like, I can;t edit it....but yeah, I'm owned and shit...wanna fuck?"
[08:12] ***DM***: o.O
[08:12] ***vP***: i m sorry i have to go....
[08:12] ***DM***: i guess if your unrestricted
[08:12] ***SS***: lol
[08:12] ***DM***: bye vita
[08:12] Zealot Benmergui: be well ***vP***dear
[08:12] ***CF*** wipes a tear at the touching display of devotion
[08:12] ***SS***: See ya Vita
[08:12] ***CF***: Take care, Vita. :)
[08:12] ***SW***: Goodbye vita
[08:12] ***vP***: thank you all for the lovely moments i wish i could stay more
[08:12] ***SS***: The devotion goes both ways
[08:12] Zealot Benmergui: Exclusivity is also a touchy point...I have never had a woman collared to me who was exclusive
[08:12] ***CF***: Does indeed
[08:13] ***SS***: it should never bne one sided
[08:13] ***SS***: be*
[08:13] Zealot Benmergui: to me it is silly to be so in SL...it is a world designed for exploration and learning about yourself..and I am going to tie the poor woman to my hip?
[08:13] ***DM***: i personally wouldnt want to be unrestricted in that sense
[08:13] ***SS***: that destroys it
[08:13] ***SS***: unrestricted doesn't mean you have to accept everyones offer
[08:13] ***CF*** nods
[08:13] ***DM***: what i give to HIm is to Him only though
[08:13] ***AD***: eh .. anything is gonna happen here ?
[08:14] Zealot Benmergui: well remember, when most Doms say Exclusive relationship...they mean she can fuck only him, and he can fuck who he likes, he is after all, the master
[08:14] ***SS***: yes!
[08:14] ***SS***: Exactly
[08:14] ***DM***: yea thats another thing lol
[08:14] ***CF***: I don't restrict my girls, but I am so picky, I end up effectively restricting myself.
[08:14] ***SS***: lol
[08:14] ***SS***: as it should be ***CF***, just cause it is there
[08:14] ***DM*** sighs...oh well..i will remain single and thats that! lol
[08:14] ***SS***: doesn't mean you have to fuck it
[08:14] ***SS***: excuse the language
[08:14] Zealot Benmergui: not a bad thing to be, Not Miss ***DM***
[08:14] ***CF*** grins
[08:15] ***DM***: nope..its actually fun Sir!
[08:15] ***SW*** slips ***DM***my phone number...
[08:15] ***DM*** laughs
[08:15] Zealot Benmergui looks at ***SS***, blinks..andputs the raggedy Ann doll down
[08:15] ***vP***: smacks him
[08:15] ***CF***: lmao
[08:15] ***SS***: a doll?
[08:15] ***SS***: I dun want a doll
[08:15] ***SS*** winks licking her lips
[08:15] ***pQ***: spent a year and a half in a restricted collar... a year and a half of stress and suspicion, more damage than good to the relationship
[08:15] ***vP***: waves bye bye and blows kisses to all
[08:15] Zealot Benmergui kicks the somewhat cum stained ragdoll under the bleachers...
[08:16] Zealot Benmergui: doll, what doll?
[08:16] ***XF***: HKW SSWW&U vita
[08:16] ***DM***: O.O
[08:16] ***CF***: Restricted should be a two way street... and if there is no trust in the relationship, it's going to be emotionally abusive anyway.
[08:16] ***DM***: i agree Sir ***CF***
[08:16] Zealot Benmergui: nods to Miss ***pQ***....I find that usually rigid monogomy in Sl just leads to cheating, lying, and alting...by all sides
[08:16] Zealot Benmergui: collar or no collar
[08:16] ***RM***: ***pQ***...that sounds more like jealousy...how can a Master be jealous? cuz jealousy is nothing but insecurity
[08:16] ***SS***: yes, exactly ***CF***
[08:17] ***CF***: Again... "restricted" means a different thing in Gor... but when you go to Gor, you know you're in for a different world.
[08:17] Zealot Benmergui: nods..GOR is something else completely
[08:17] ***pQ***: it was... stressful, at the very least. but yes, He was very jealous
[08:17] ***SS***: there is no restriction in Gor
[08:17] ***SS***: not in the books I have read
[08:17] Zealot Benmergui: remember, trying to directly equate Gor and D/s is like trying to compare 14th century France and D& D
[08:17] ***DM***: its not impossible to find the monogamus relationhsip..some Masters i think want that *shrugs
[08:17] Zealot Benmergui: sort of similar...but not really
[08:18] ***CF*** chuckles
[08:18] ***XF***: then the Master isnt wanting to be aMaster
[08:18] ***DM***: what?
[08:18] Zealot Benmergui: Some do...but it is few and far between...and remember, look up at the club above us
[08:18] ***DM***: yes i know Sir Zealot
[08:18] Zealot Benmergui: that is House of V, likely the most successful BDSM club in SL currently, and has been for a couple years
[08:19] ***SS***: it is
[08:19] ***SS***: and with good reason
[08:19] Zealot Benmergui: it is filled with subs..whose main sport is taking the men publically claimed by OTHER subs
[08:19] ***DM*** scrunches he rnose
[08:19] Zealot Benmergui: it is the same throughout BDSM online
[08:19] Zealot Benmergui: because BDSM online is a SOCIAL creation
[08:19] Zealot Benmergui: BDSM in rl is far more about couples
[08:19] Zealot Benmergui: here, it is the club scene almost completely
[08:20] ***DM***: hmmm
[08:20] Zealot Benmergui: so there is massive poaching, and constant, massive temptation
[08:20] ***RM***: and that's not necessarily a good thing, especially for ppl who are just learning
[08:20] ***SS***: I am tempted every single day...
[08:20] Zealot Benmergui: I get 10 IMs a day from various clubs I wander through from women
[08:20] ***SW***: Are you saying then there's almost an exhibitionist aspect to clooaring - "look at this little hottie, and she's all mine not yours"?
[08:20] Zealot Benmergui: just checking to see if I am interested
[08:21] ***DM***: well if you ask me...and i know no one did, but not as a sub but as a woman alone they shouldnt be that way
[08:21] Zealot Benmergui: Absolutely
[08:21] ***SW***: *collaring* - apologies for the typo
[08:21] ***DM***: its a relfection of your charector
[08:21] ***DM***: grr i cant spell today
[08:21] Zealot Benmergui: true...but it is also assumed to be the way the social enviornment works
[08:22] Zealot Benmergui: on Facebook you freind a stranger to get to know them...here, you suck their cock...
[08:22] ***SS***: lol
[08:22] ***DM***: its like rl married men..why do women go after em? its sad
[08:22] ***SW***: I'd rather just chat
[08:22] ***DM***: LOL
[08:22] Zealot Benmergui shrugs...C'est la guerre
[08:22] ***SS***: To each thier own
[08:22] ***SS***: ya wanna suck cock, so be it
[08:22] ***DM***: lol
[08:22] ***DM***: i wanna suck cock...but not one that is taken lmaoj
[08:22] ***SS***: ya wanna take 50 collars in three months, so be it
[08:22] Zealot Benmergui: Collars are one element of the social scene, as they are one element of a D/s relationship
[08:23] ***SS***: it is all your choice
[08:23] Zealot Benmergui: exactly...there is that word again..CHOICE
[08:23] Zealot Benmergui: I can't stress that enough, every lecture, every topic..D/s is about CHOICE and CONSENT
[08:24] Zealot Benmergui: a colar is a CHOICE
[08:24] Zealot Benmergui: a lack of one is also a CHOICE
[08:24] ***SS***: I choose to enjoy, myself, others may choose something else
[08:24] Zealot Benmergui: and you consent to what it means
[08:24] Zealot Benmergui: it can;tbe imposed or forced on you...
[08:24] ***DM***: i choose lack of one for now! lol
[08:24] Zealot Benmergui: and yes, people say WELL WHAT ABOUT GOR, YOU QUEER IN A PURPLE SUIT
[08:24] ***CF***: It's important to understand what the expectations are before giving or taking a collar... then it's informed choice, rather than blind choice.
[08:25] Zealot Benmergui: in Gor it is not imposed..you CONSENT to the RP when you go to the Sim
[08:25] Zealot Benmergui: there are billiosn of signs and notecards
[08:25] Zealot Benmergui: it is still CONSENSUAL
[08:25] ***RM***: well, the biggest problem i see is not knowing the difference between D/s and rp
[08:25] Zealot Benmergui: which is always the problem
[08:25] ***SS***: in this place, Gor has lost it' beauty
[08:25] ***DM*** nods
[08:25] ***SS***: completely
[08:25] Zealot Benmergui: she is seeking love..he is seeking something to do while WoW is down
[08:25] ***DM***: lol
[08:25] ***pQ***: i never honor forced collars ooc, unless the forced aspect is previously agreed on for rp
[08:26] ***SS***: yes!
[08:26] ***RM***: lmao exactly!!
[08:26] ***CF*** chuckles
[08:26] ***SS***: don't even get me started on "forced collars"
[08:26] Zealot Benmergui: which is why I said the collar has to mean the same thing to each of you
[08:26] ***CF*** chuckles
[08:26] ***DM***: thats a new subject to me completely!
[08:27] Zealot Benmergui: forced collars are an RP convention....
[08:27] ***DM***: oh..no wonder ok
[08:27] ***SS***: it is BS
[08:27] ***SS***: in any sense of it
[08:27] Zealot Benmergui: but they aren;t forced..it's like puttingyour name in a sweepstakes...you want to be chosen, but don;t know if you will or no
[08:27] ***CF***: Well, again, if you're submissive and standing in a sim where forced collars are allowed... you need to understand that you're prey.
[08:27] ***DM***: hmmm
[08:27] ***SS***: if it is stated, so be it
[08:27] ***SS***: rules are rules
[08:27] Zealot Benmergui: people will TREAT them as real...because most people, are sadly, idiots
[08:27] ***CF*** nods
[08:28] ***CF***: lmao
[08:28] Zealot Benmergui: most decent Gor sims will state that the Collar does not apply out of the Sim
[08:28] ***DM***: i wonder why im scared to venture away from HOV lol
[08:28] ***SS***: yeah right lmao
[08:28] ***XF***: i am an idiot
[08:28] ***XF***: yep
[08:28] ***CF***: Right... It should be real for no more than your current logged on session.
[08:28] ***SS***: exactly
[08:28] Zealot Benmergui: I mean, how can the collar be a symbol of an intelligent lifestyle choice when it is understood if the Master is silent for 20 minutes, the colalr is gone and you have "escaped"
[08:29] ***DM***: dang
[08:29] Zealot Benmergui: how many marriages would survive "If your husband is silent for 20 minutes, you are divorced"
[08:29] ***pQ***: most people i know in Gor have a 3 day cap/force collar limit
[08:29] ***XF***: thats why i aint married .. sheesh .. thanks
[08:29] ***CF*** chuckles... A poaching restriction?
[08:29] ***SW***: PLaying Devil's advocate, how many wives CAN stay silent for 20 minutes... *laughing*
[08:29] Zealot Benmergui: Sean, you are a courageous man
[08:30] Zealot Benmergui: Good bye
[08:30] ***SW***: I'll get my coat
[08:30] ***MS*** snickers.
[08:30] ***CF*** chuckles
[08:30] Zealot Benmergui: run while you can
[08:30] ***CF***: Leave the coat, the claws are already out
[08:30] ***XF***: hey is that why i aint married..
[08:30] ***XF***: lmao
[08:30] ***CF***: Save yourself
[08:30] ***CF***: ;)
[08:30] Zealot Benmergui: Gorean forced collars are not relationship collars, but rp props...
[08:30] ***MS*** didn't know she had her claws out. Opps.
[08:31] ***SS***: usualy
[08:31] Zealot Benmergui: however, I have known some that BECAME relationships
[08:31] ***SS***: usually*
[08:31] Zealot Benmergui: and again, each one is different
[08:31] ***pQ***: yes, usually. some expect it to be honored the same as a willing collar.
[08:31] ***DM***: kind of like a claim here then
[08:31] Zealot Benmergui: some women go to RP sims like that to have the choice totally removed as to WHO collars them
[08:31] Zealot Benmergui: they just want someone to claim them...
[08:31] ***CF***: Right, sometimes the prop becomes real, and that's an individual case basis. Trouble comes when people don't know the difference between the prop and the real thing.
[08:32] ***SS***: bottom line is, you are in control... until you release that control
[08:32] Zealot Benmergui: exactly
[08:32] ***DM***: hit the x button?
[08:32] Zealot Benmergui: Submission is CONSENSUAL
[08:32] Zealot Benmergui: so is accepting a collar
[08:32] ***CT*** sits listerning wondering what the topic was.
[08:32] Zealot Benmergui: never forget the best safe word is always "Get away you fucking freak MUTE EXIT
[08:33] ***DM***: lmao
[08:33] ***SS***: yeah
[08:33] ***RM***: lmao Sir
[08:33] ***SS***: well there are others too
[08:33] ***DM***: dont cry and ask him why he thinks he deserves repsect? lol
[08:33] Zealot Benmergui: MY BOYFRIEND IS A LAWYER is good
[08:33] ***SS***: but always remember that you can say NO
[08:34] Zealot Benmergui: the best safe word, truly, is discussing what you like and dislike, want and don;t want before things go physical at all
[08:34] Zealot Benmergui: but that is often not possible for most on SL
[08:35] Zealot Benmergui: and that is also the best way to accept a collar...after much discussion of what it means and doesn;t mean
[08:35] ***pQ***: people lie so much here... lie like a bad toupe. lots of time is key, time will reveal lies
[08:35] ***CT***: To many take the collar to soon, before realising what it entails, and as such the term velcro collar was born- More so in gor- and please excuse me if i took it off topic.. missed most of the lesson
[08:36] Zealot Benmergui: no, thatis quite fair
[08:36] ***CF***: You're right on topic. ;)
[08:36] Zealot Benmergui: also, people tend to view Collars like sex in the 1950s
[08:36] ***CT*** has experience in both Furry ( as you can see ) and Gor - but i find most do not understand he true meaning of submission
[08:36] Zealot Benmergui: OH gee, I let him have his way with me, now we will marry and be together forever
[08:37] Zealot Benmergui: collars are learning experiences...you will likely wear several in your time online as a sub
[08:38] Zealot Benmergui: part of it is, Miss Trieliss, that each persons submission is their own, and may be true to them
[08:39] Zealot Benmergui: the trick is making sure that the submissive and the Dominant AGREE on what it means, as well as what the collar means
[08:39] Zealot Benmergui: my normal view of submission is a bit less, well..bovine, then yours.,..doesn't make yours any less valid
[08:39] ***CT***: it is also a learning path, for there is no right or wrong to submission and domination, one Dom/me expects one thing.. another somehing else.
[08:39] ***pQ***: so not just consent is important, but *informed* consent, on both parts
[08:40] Zealot Benmergui: absolutely
[08:40] Zealot Benmergui: consent in this context implies informed, intelligent consideration
[08:40] Zealot Benmergui: not SO HORNY FINE FUCK ME AND I WILL WEAR THE STUPID COLLAR THING
[08:40] ***RM***: lmao
[08:41] ***CT*** chuckles.
[08:41] ***SW*** laughs
[08:41] ***pQ***: chuckles
[08:42] ***MS*** grins.
[08:42] Zealot Benmergui: though a lot of women have logged in to find that when they tossed their panties over the Jim Beam bottle last night, they also somehow ended up collared
[08:42] ***CT***: the collar itself is not the submission, for it as useful as a top I wear, .. as submission is form the heart, a sub doesnt have to wear a collar to know whom s/he is. Nor does s/he has to be fucked ( hough that is very nice indeed sometimes )
[08:42] Zealot Benmergui: funny how that works
[08:42] Zealot Benmergui: Absolutely Miss Trieliss, a collar is a symbol, which may or may not be needed, and means something different to each person
[08:43] Zealot Benmergui: let me get a little buiness out of the way quickly...
[08:43] ***CT***: same can be said for guys too Sir can it not? after all "some" guys can be lead by their...................... XD
[08:43] ***RM***: definitely ***CT***
[08:43] Zealot Benmergui: Is there any other way a man is led, Miss Trieliss?
[08:43] ***CT***: Yes.
[08:43] Zealot Benmergui: it sticks a few inches ahead of us for a REASON
[08:43] ***CT***: again its not about the physican sex that can bring either D or s
[08:44] Zealot Benmergui: smiles...quite correct.
[08:44] ***pQ***: mmhmm, love it when a guy offers me a collar 5 minutes after meeting me, and i can tell it's just because he likes my av and wants to fuck me whenever he chooses... NOT
[08:44] ***CT*** grins wickedly " but its a darn good way to lead.. hmm prince alberts "
[08:44] Zealot Benmergui: I hate to break it to you dear, but whenever he chooses will likely mean once, then on to the next
[08:44] ***RM***: yeah what is it about ppl being really turned on by cartoons?
[08:44] ***pQ***: laughs, You don't meet the Men i do, Sir
[08:45] ***SS***: For me
[08:45] ***pQ***: i wish they would move on that easily
[08:45] Zealot Benmergui: then my congratulations to your skill
[08:45] ***SS***: it's the person, behind the computer, the words, the commonalities.. the attraction
[08:45] ***SS***: and that takes time
[08:45] ***RM*** nods at ***SS***
[08:45] Zealot Benmergui: there is a reason why they say the largest sex organ is the brain
[08:46] ***pQ***: any girl who has a decent av and can string a sentence together well, isn't going to get rid of most of them that easily.. no skill needed, i'm not that conceited
[08:46] ***SS***: the initial attraction is there, we are a very visual culture
[08:46] Zealot Benmergui: ok business....please remember to tip your humble lecturer by paying me directly if you so choose..Heroin just keeps getting more expensive
[08:46] ***SS***: yes it is
[08:46] ***CT***: to many though are inpatient, they orefer the click click loving, rather hen the words, the description the emotions and the intesity that good writing can do
[08:46] Zealot Benmergui: remember next week, same day and time here at House of V
[08:47] Zealot Benmergui: and Thursdays, 9 AM SLT at Velvet Thorn, a femdom sim

Jealousy - 8/7/09

[12:13] Pirate Russell: Ok, please take all cross talk to IM, and all collar, etc commands to the secondary channels!
[12:13] ***VS***: yes, sorry
[12:13] ***AD***: yes, smiles
[12:13] Pirate Russell: Welcome to House of V's College of Kink! As most of y'all know, My name is Pirate Russell, Head Mistress of the College, and today's instructor. I have been in SL for 3 1/2 years, a lesbian Domme, the entire time.
[12:13] ***AL***: well than need to get practicing more.. you in Nordhaven?
[12:13] Pirate Russell: IM Please, that's the cross talk to which I illude
[12:14] Pirate Russell: For any that need to leave early, all transcripts can be found at http://collegeofkink.blogspot.com
[12:14] Pirate Russell: DISCLAIMER: I have no training or schooling in Psychology,Psychiatry, or Counseling of ANY kind! All of My observations are from My real life and what I've found on the web
[12:14] Pirate Russell: If you are having problems dealing with Jealousy, PLEASE PLEASE contact a competent professional!
[12:14] Pirate Russell: Jealousy typically refers to the thoughts, feelings, and behaviors that occur when a person believes a valued relationship is being threatened by a rival.
[12:14] Pirate Russell: Dr. Jennifer James, author of "Women and the Blues: Passions That Hurt, Passions That Heal", wrote:
[12:14] Pirate Russell: "Jealousy is simply and clearly the fear that you do not have value. Jealousy scans for evidence to prove the point - that others will be preferred and rewarded more than you.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: I'd add that you don't have value to the person that's causing you the pain, not value in general
[12:15] Pirate Russell: There is only one alternative - self-value. If you cannot love yourself, you will not believe that you are loved. You will always think it's a mistake or luck.
[12:15] Pirate Russell: Take your eyes off others and turn the scanner within. Find the seeds of your jealousy, clear the old voices and experiences."
[12:16] Pirate Russell: Jealousy is an emotion that can be very damaging to ANY relationship. It can also prevent you from growing emotionally.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: It is not the same thing as envy. Jealousy wants what someone else has. Envy is when you don't want someone else to have what you don't have.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: If a person is jealous, they already have what is desired but they are afraid of losing it.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: When you are feeling jealous, you are undergoing an emotional combination of anger, dependency, hurt, and self doubt. When you spend time focusing on what you are not, this is a result of insecurity.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: Sometimes when we are afraid of losing something, we actually cause it to happen because of our actions and behaviors.
[12:16] Pirate Russell: All our thoughts and actions are centered around our fears and insecurities. This causes more fear and insecurity. These feelings cause other harmful feelings and may result in us indulging in self pity.
[12:17] Pirate Russell: What are some ways of dealing with jealousy?
[12:17] Pirate Russell: * Develop independence. We need to be sure we are not overly dependant on any one person. We need to focus on the good things we have and not on what we don't have.
[12:17] Pirate Russell: * Focus on developing more confidence and attractiveness. Sometimes something simple like getting our hair done or changing our style of clothing can help.
[12:17] ***RJ***: i try and focus on positive things instead of falling into a downward spiral
[12:18] Pirate Russell: Yepper, Raiina, that's the idea!
[12:18] Pirate Russell: Taking a course on self esteem or assertiveness is also beneficial.
[12:18] Pirate Russell: * Be honest with yourself. Sit down with paper and list things that are making you jealous. Look at it objectively. Are these things silly or trivial or are they really important?
[12:18] Pirate Russell: * Communicate with the person who is the object of your jealousy. Tell them your feelings. Is that person doing something that is causing you to be jealous? Letting them know can often help the problem.
[12:18] Pirate Russell: If this other person cares for you, they will work on changing the behavior that is adding to your jealousy. Being aware of your feelings can also help you cope better.
[12:19] Pirate Russell: Realize that jealousy shows your lack of self esteem and uncertainty of your own worth. Work on taking a really good self evaluation.
[12:19] Pirate Russell: This experience can be a wonderful learning opportunity for you. Work on communication with other people. Work on developing confidence.
[12:19] Pirate Russell: * Study your rival. Look closely at the person you are jealous about. What do you like and dislike about the person? Are his or her qualities beyond your abilities? Be sure you are not being unrealistic about that person. Are you seeing things as they
[12:20] Pirate Russell: Take control of your feelings. Terminate the relationship if nothing else seems to work. Take the time to concentrate on your own growth. Work at trying to understand and improve your relationship.
[12:20] Pirate Russell: * Do not overreact. Remember, most incidents are temporary so don't magnify what happened.
[12:20] Pirate Russell: Serious jealousy stems from a fear of loss, reputation, control of ourselves, our spouses, or relationships. Losing control of our emotions and feelings will only make things worse.
[12:20] Pirate Russell: Bad reactions to Jealousy can even cause legal problems. I spent almoust 7 years as a Public Safety Telecommunications Officer (Big words for 911 Dispatcher).
[12:21] Pirate Russell: Not one shift went by where I didn't deal with a seriuos domestic problem. Most, I'd wager, stemmed from jealousy. How many of us have read this in or local or national news media, "If I can't have him/her, then nobody can!" I've know that many people
[12:21] Pirate Russell: I, for one, don't want to be someplace I'm not wanted. That's not fun for Me!
[12:21] Pirate Russell: Yipe random trunkation
[12:21] ***VS*** smiles
[12:21] ***LF*** nods
[12:22] Pirate Russell: I know many people have been arrested from jealousy realated issues, when they wouldn't have been arrested otherwise.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: Likewise, I dont' force anyone, particularly My submissives to be with Me if they're not having fun.
[12:22] Pirate Russell: This is part of My Primary rule, that real life comes first, if you're not having fun, let's go do something that is, together or apart!
[12:23] Pirate Russell: I do get jealous sometimes. My girls have significant others with whom they spend time. I INSIST that they do! One has a fiancee, one a girl friend, and another a girl of her own.
[12:23] Pirate Russell: I miss them when they're not around, I am envious of the time they spend away, but I want them to have fun.
[12:23] Pirate Russell: Knowing they're having fun makes it all ok for Me. I want My girls, My friends, My acquaintences, and even most of My enemies to have fun.
[12:23] Pirate Russell: By having other friends, they've places to go have fun when I'm alone with one of the other girls. Even when I'm alone with one, I envy the time that the others spend away.
[12:24] Pirate Russell: I'm going to close today with one of My very favorite quotes on the subject, by Robert A Heinlein,
[12:24] Pirate Russell: "Love" is that condition in which the happiness of another person is essential to your own...
[12:24] Pirate Russell: Jealousy is a disease, love is a healthy condition. The immature mind often mistakes one for the other, or assumes that the greater the love, the greater the jealousy."
[12:25] Pirate Russell: Citations:
[12:25] Pirate Russell: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jealousy
[12:25] Pirate Russell: http://www.allaboutlifechallenges.org/dealing-with-jealousy-faq.htm
[12:25] Pirate Russell: http://www.todays-woman.net/quoteid-2304.html
[12:25] Pirate Russell: http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/r/robert_a_heinlein.html
[12:25] Pirate Russell: Questions???? Comments?
[12:25] ***AL*** looking at Pirate. "No all makes sense"
[12:26] ***LF*** agrees with***AL***
[12:26] ***AD***: nods good things to think about when those feeling happen
[12:26] Pirate Russell: Awww... the discussion is My favorite part! LOL
[12:26] ***VS*** smiles
[12:26] ***LF*** chuckles
[12:27] ***AD***: laughs
[12:27] ***VS***: it is all great advice, indeed
[12:27] Pirate Russell knows good crap when I hear it! LOL
[12:27] ***VS***: but, I mean how does our SL environment affect this?
[12:27] Pirate Russell: er steal it!
[12:27] ***VS***: People do in fact just completely deisappear here
[12:27] ***VS***: they can turn in to other people
[12:27] ***RJ*** nods
[12:27] Pirate Russell: Well, yes, they do, and hat was last week's class, actually.
[12:27] ***AD***: lol
[12:27] ***DM***: well, just as in RL.
[12:27] Pirate Russell: Easier than in RL, can yo udo this in RL?
[12:27] ***VS***: ooh, sorry
[12:28] ***AL***: its the perfect approach, engage, avoid syndrom lol
[12:28] Pirate Russell: he he
[12:28] ***LF***: they just make new avtars when they feel like the pressure is too much
[12:28] ***VS***: Right
[12:28] ***AL***: or they screwed the person over enough
[12:28] Pirate Russell: Or make changes that drive others away!
[12:28] ***VS***: yeah
[12:28] ***DM***: Yeah - it's much easier to get emotinaly involved - you can project much more of your ideal world on people and relations here.
[12:29] ***VS***: last year I met someone who said in his profile, he wanted to make tfewer mistakes and be a better person
[12:29] ***VS***: I took that as like, great this person is going to be careful --
[12:29] ***VS***: nope!
[12:29] Pirate Russell: Yes, and you can talk about embarrassing things and not run into the people later in the Market
[12:29] ***VS***: yes, to ***DM***'s point
[12:29] ***VS***: and that makes it so much harder to contemplate losing that person
[12:29] ***DM*** nods.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: for Instance, I'm NOwhere, as attractive physically as Pirate, but she IS Me!
[12:30] ***DM*** snickers.
[12:30] ***DM***: Me neither.
[12:30] Pirate Russell: emotionally, mentally
[12:31] Pirate Russell: But that's a tad off topic...
[12:31] Pirate Russell: which I have NO Problem with, but let's wrap up jealousy first.. he he
[12:31] ***VS***: yes, I understand
[12:32] Pirate Russell: Anyone else have anything on jealousy?
[12:32] ***VS***: but I guess because people touch us here on those sensitive places,
[12:32] ***DM***: But I'm still thinking about yiour main argument - simply put you said that jealousy is a symptom of low self esteem?
[12:32] ***VS***: and we get close so fast, maybe there is more jealousy, I don;t know
[12:32] Pirate Russell: Yes, I know that many people don't realize the RL impact of playing "this Game".
[12:33] ***DM*** nods.
[12:33] ***AD***: I tend to back away when I get jealous and try to disconnect
[12:33] Pirate Russell: Well, with Jealousy, ***DM***, you already have the relationshiop
[12:33] Pirate Russell: er relationship
[12:34] Pirate Russell: you're afraid that Love will like Me better, and she'll leave you for Me
[12:34] Pirate Russell: If you are self confident, and KNOW her well, you know that even though she'd tied up in My dungeon, she's coming home to you.
[12:34] Pirate Russell: ((NO BULLETS, RANDOM EXAMPLE))
[12:34] ***RJ***: im in a relationship that started here in sl and has crossed over to RL . and i suck at jealousy its a posion
[12:35] ***DM*** nods "Yes - or I could even accept that she may not come back."
[12:35] Pirate Russell: Yes, it will cause you so much doubt in other areas.
[12:35] ***VS***: it is very hard
[12:35] Pirate Russell: yes, it is hard, waiting on someone else to make a decision, even small ones, that affect us directly is the hardest there is, I think!
[12:36] ***DM*** nods.
[12:36] ***LF***: i think you both honest it works better , lying kills it
[12:36] ***VS***: I agree there
[12:36] ***VS***: relationships take a lot of talking
[12:36] ***AD***: yes they do
[12:36] Pirate Russell: Yes, trust will get you thru things that will kill other relationships, lying will ruin an otherwise GREAT relationship
[12:36] ***DM***: ah - that's difficult - if you're really RPing here, it's all a fiction.
[12:37] ***LF***: RPing is diffrent
[12:37] Pirate Russell: Not all, because I draw on experiences, and take some RP stuff to RL, and My hubby's pretty happy 'bout that! he he
[12:37] ***DM***: Yea - but some people UsT play a role.
[12:37] ***AD***: laughs
[12:37] ***DM***: *JUST
[12:37] ***RJ***: ummsometimes the truth is just as painful
[12:38] ***VS***: Yes,
[12:38] ***LF***: Yes
[12:38] Pirate Russell: Is that possible, or do our FL Selves get into that role?
[12:38] ***RJ***: although i respect Him more for being truthful
[12:38] ***VS***: I mean sometimes you *are* going to be left for another person, but -- it is better to know it than have it be behind your back
[12:38] ***VS***: then you are hurt and also, feel like a fool and it ruins your trust in people going forward
[12:39] Pirate Russell: Everyone but 3 people have eventually left Me in RL.... hubby and kids are the ones I count on!
[12:39] ***VS***: it's a reality we have to live with,
[12:39] ***DM***: well, but loss causes pain - that's natural and halthy.
[12:39] ***VS***: the exchange of love that comes before it is worth it
[12:39] ***VS***: but I guess what I want to know is --
[12:39] ***DM***: *healthy
[12:39] Pirate Russell: Yes, I agree, I'm a happy, healthy, person!
[12:39] ***VS***: how not to let the endings get so horrible they sour what came before
[12:40] ***VS***: all things change, eventually
[12:40] Pirate Russell: Absolutely, as the Country song goes.. "You gotta be strong enouth to bend"
[12:40] ***DM***: I think it's a way to deal with it - you think it was all bad to make the loss look smaller.
[12:41] ***VS***: that's true
[12:41] ***VS***: that makes the loss, in reality, so much worse
[12:41] Pirate Russell: Yes, when you're looking back, it's hard to go forward!
[12:42] ***LF***: well you say its a game , but sometimes it hurts more than RL , as you do things here you would never do in RL
[12:42] ***DM*** nods at Vee "Of course it does - because it makes you a fool - having belierved in something that actually was bad. "
[12:42] Pirate Russell: No, I put that in quotes. Some thing it is, 'till they get here and make friends, have relationships, etc.
[12:43] Pirate Russell: er some THINK it is
[12:44] ***VS***: but if in fact you gave and recieved love then, that is healing and good, to look back and say that was false, now that is a worse loss
[12:44] ***VS***: but it is often jealousy that does that, so, it takes two things
[12:44] ***DM***: yes, I agree, ***VS***.
[12:45] Pirate Russell: Well, I strive to give love like I "lend" Money. If Keesha wanted 1000Lindens, I'd give it to her, and if I get it back, great, if not, it's a gift, and I don't need to track her down
[12:45] ***VS***: what can help there, Pirate,
[12:45] ***VS***: cognitively,
[12:45] ***VS***: after it is over, to look back with -
[12:45] ***VS***: fondness?
[12:45] ***VS***: yes
[12:45] Pirate Russell: same with love, I love people cuz I love them, not cuz they love Me!
[12:45] ***VS***: absolutely
[12:46] ***DM***: happiness to have had the liuck to experience the love of a great person - asnd pain to have lost it, I think.
[12:46] ***SF***: What about being with someone that over time, subtly exploits your weaknesses and insecurities....all before you have time to realize that has happened. How does a person recover from that?
[12:46] Pirate Russell: Well, when relationships end, you go the same grieving process as when someone dies.
[12:46] ***DM*** nods at Pirate.
[12:46] ***VS*** smiles
[12:47] ***VS***: yes
[12:47] ***KN***: it's a defensive emotion, when you break up you feel sad, in order to defend yourself and return to content or happy you get angry, often times jealousy will stem from the anger as an attempt to protect oneself even more, they're primal responses like fight or flight, survival of the fittest
[12:47] Pirate Russell: recoginzing that you're gonna be pissed, in denial, etc makes it easier to deal with each one, then get on to remembering the good times
[12:48] Pirate Russell: Might take an hour or a lifetime, though.
[12:48] ***DM***: {sorry - invitee ar CARP}
[12:48] ***KN***: the jealousy feeds off the anger in an attempt to make ones self bigger in a sense hoing to win the lost one back, thusly re-establishing yourself as the 'fittest'
[12:48] ***KN***: hoping*
[12:48] Pirate Russell: yes, ***KN***, if you let it!
[12:49] ***KN***: it's a downward spiral, the trick is recognising the spiral and getting out of it, what seperates man from ape
[12:49] Pirate Russell: And an enemy seen is MUCH more defeatable!
[12:49] ***VS***: very true
[12:50] ***VS***: specially if they can't see you!
[12:50] ***VS***: sun tzu says
[12:50] ***AD***: smiles--love the teachings of sun tzu
[12:50] ***VS***: Pirate, how do you manage jealousy between your subs,
[12:50] ***VS***: when they get jealous of the others spending time with you?
[12:50] Pirate Russell's favorite audiobook is Sun Tzu and the art of war!
[12:51] ***VS***: they are words to live by
[12:51] Pirate Russell: Well, ***VS***, I'm VERY lucky!
[12:51] ***VS***: whoops
[12:51] ***VS***: Hello Master
[12:51] ***AL***: also has an version done for executives to apply to business Krause adapted it
[12:51] Pirate Russell: 2 of My 3 girls that I see regularly, are not the jealous type.
[12:51] ***VS***: Pirate, this is my Master, ***AS***
[12:51] Pirate Russell: Welcome ***AS***
[12:51] ***VS***: /
[12:52] ***AS*** bows......"Hello Pirate......Please excuse my dropping out of the sky like that."
[12:52] Pirate Russell: No worries, you missed My toe! he he
[12:52] Pirate Russell: The 3rd woudn't be happy if she was grafted to My hip 24X7
[12:52] Pirate Russell: It woudn't be enough
[12:52] ***AS***: Mind if I sit?
[12:52] Pirate Russell: I insist!
[12:52] ***AD***: how do you deal with that
[12:53] Pirate Russell: Basically tough love.
[12:53] ***AD***: nods
[12:53] Pirate Russell: I tell her that tonight, I'm going with one of her sisters, or a friend, or whatever.
[12:53] Pirate Russell: It's hard for her, but she's got to deal wit hthat, I can't do that for her
[12:54] Pirate Russell: WB, Love
[12:54] ***AS*** smiles and waves to Love
[12:54] ***VS***: and she does not create problems with the others,
[12:54] ***VS***: or, you knbow, how to describe it,
[12:54] ***VS***: pout and such?
[12:54] ***LF***: ***AS***!, hugs
[12:54] ***AS*** hugs Love
[12:54] ***AS***: Hey there sweetie
[12:54] ***AD***: smiles at them
[12:54] Pirate Russell: No, she tries to guilt Me sometimes, but the others, if she's taking it to them, haven't told Me about it, and at least one of them would, and the 2nd one BETTER! LOL
[12:55] ***AS*** grins.....It's usually polite to ask before you sit on my face love...
[12:55] ***AS*** chuckles
[12:55] Pirate Russell: LOL
[12:55] ***LF***: laughs, "Shuuhhhh"
[12:55] ***VS***: well, that is good
[12:55] ***LF*** will be right back.
[12:55] ***AD***: laughs
[12:55] Pirate Russell: ::pushes Her hair out of Her face & calls 2nds
[12:55] ***VS***: in the past, have yo uhad bad situations with that, that you had to learn how to deal wsith?
[12:56] Pirate Russell: Yes, and it turned out to be THEIR rpoblem, and they've left the family. I have a monogamous relationship in RL, don't want that in SL
[12:56] ***AS*** laughs and wiggles his tongue at Pirate....."Sorry Vee's got first dibs."
[12:56] Pirate Russell: But we talk about it ALL the time
[12:56] ***VS***: Exasctly
[12:57] ***VS***: that issue specifically
[12:58] ***VS***: a lot of people don;t want to accept that, even though at first they say they do
[12:58] Pirate Russell: Yes, and that helps her, and she's not on a lot, so when she is I try to make time for her.
[13:00] ***LF***: I think talking is the main one , then you can both work on it together
[13:00] ***SF***: What is a girl to do when her Master will not discuss the issue? How does a girl work through it then?
[13:00] Pirate Russell: Even if you don't/can't solve the issue, showing that it's not something you're ignoring helps a lot, too.
[13:01] ***LF***: then is he the right Master, if you want to talk about it and he doesn t
[13:01] Pirate Russell: If a girl woudn't discuss things, I'd release her
[13:01] ***KN***: you get rid of that SLaster
[13:02] Pirate Russell: Remember D/s IS a relationship, RL or SL. If you're not in the right relationship, maybe it's time to move on.
[13:02] ***LF***: i think it takes time to find the right person, some think it happens right away , i think it doesn t
[13:02] ***SF***: Already have, just needed to understand things better......know that i wasn't being unreasonable.
[13:03] ***AL***: Excuse us. We don't have much more SL time together today so ***AD*** and I are going to head out. Pirate we enjoy this and would love to attend more sessions.
[13:03] ***AD***: Thank you very much pirate--smiles at her
[13:03] Pirate Russell: ***SF***, sweetie, we're all in SL to have fun. If you're not having fun, go do something, in or out, of SL to have fun!
[13:03] ***LF***: Pirate is was very intresting Thank You
[13:04] Pirate Russell: coming here for pain and crying, unlesss that's your kink, is NOT why I buy Lindens!
[13:04] ***AS*** nods in agreement
[13:04] ***AL***: Good to meet you all and ***VS***; practice!
[13:04] ***VS*** grins
[13:04] ***VS***: I shall
[13:05] Pirate Russell: Thanks for coming!
[13:05] ***AD***: His favorite words *laughs
[13:05] ***SF***: You are very right, and i am slowly mending and getting back to having fun.....i just didn't know much then....
[13:05] ***SF***: Thank You, this was most informative.
[13:05] ***LF***: it takes time , after 2 years i think i have finally lerned to control it well
[13:05] ***VS***: ***SF***, it can really sneak up on you if you are not talking all the time I think
[13:05] ***AD***: be well to all of you:))
[13:06] Pirate Russell: Thatks to y'all, I learn more from y'all, and about Me from the discussions, than I do the research for the talk!
[13:06] ***SF*** smiles, "yes ***VS***, you are so very right."
[13:06] ***AS*** chuckles
[13:07] ***AS***: Yeah......Course Vee says I talk too much...
[13:07] ***AS*** grins at Vee and winks
[13:07] ***VS*** smiles,
[13:07] ***LF*** chuckles to herself
[13:07] ***VS***: I never say that, Master
[13:07] ***VS***: I never would
[13:08] ***VS*** smiles
[13:08] ***AS*** smiles
[13:08] ***AS***: I know
[13:08] ***VS***: well,
[13:08] ***AS***: Vee and I talk a whole lot ***SF***....
[13:08] ***LF*** runs back to CARP "Thank you!, it was very good"
[13:08] ***AS***: And anybody who isn't willing or able to talk.....I probably gonna be difficult to be with in the long run
[13:08] Pirate Russell: Welcome, and thanks, Love
[13:08] ***AS***: Bye love
[13:09] ***SF*** smiles
[13:09] ***VS***: and even with talking a lot we have our moments but it's the talking that gets us past them
[13:09] Pirate Russell: Hell, ***VS***, with TEACHING it I have My moments!
[13:10] ***VS*** laughs
[13:10] ***AS*** chuckles
[13:10] ***AS***: Well, when you make your SL sub cry in RL.....You've probably done something wrong.
[13:10] Pirate Russell: yes, and no, ***AS***.
[13:10] ***VS***: Crying happens, Master
[13:11] Pirate Russell: I've had the most powerful scene with My ibrew, and we both cried
[13:11] ***VS***: it is not always because of an infracxtion of some kind
[13:11] ***AS***: Well
[13:11] ***AS***: I was going to follow with
[13:11] ***AS***: But you're not gonna make it better if you can't talk about it
[13:11] Pirate Russell: all it was was... I have a ruler that spanks several places, and was making her tell Me where to hit her next
[13:11] Pirate Russell: I've got goose bumps now, thinking about it!
[13:12] ***VS*** nods
[13:12] ***SF*** smiles
[13:12] ***VS***: that could be intense
[13:12] ***AS*** nods
[13:12] Pirate Russell: It was, she hit subspace, before either of us knew what it was, I found Domspaice for the first time
[13:12] Pirate Russell: and last time...
[13:12] ***KN***: haha, I was just about to ask if you did
[13:13] ***VS***: Pirate,
[13:13] Pirate Russell: Hubby saw Me crying, and He almost had Me leave SL, until I explained that it was a good thing, like a GOOD book, or Old Yeller.
[13:13] Pirate Russell: yes?
[13:13] ***VS***: ooh, old Yeller, ouch
[13:13] ***VS***: well I was going to ask about those expressions,
[13:13] Pirate Russell: But it was really a 'recreational cry!"
[13:13] ***VS***: I am noew to this life, and I haven;t herard them before, subspace and Dopmspace
[13:14] Pirate Russell: That's a whole other class, but I've heard subspace described as going to a 'place' where a submissive can't look out for themselves, almost a trance
[13:14] Pirate Russell: fueled by endorphins in the brain
[13:15] ***KN***: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subspace_(BDSM)
[13:15] Pirate Russell: Thanks ***KN***
[13:16] ***KN***: I teach a class on it to ponygirls, who are especialy susceptible to it
[13:16] ***VS***: thank you, ***KN***
[13:16] ***VS***: Really
[13:17] ***VS***: I;ve been trying to catch that ponby class for a long time, it has not worked
[13:17] ***VS***: but I p0lan to
[13:18] ***KN***: subspace in RL can be an addiction, subspace in SL can be extremely dangerous, since SL connections are so unreliable and the care and support required to bring one out of subspace
[13:20] ***VS***: well,
[13:21] ***VS***: I mean I certainly know people who seek that experience, and aren;t to careful about who they are getting it from --
[13:21] ***VS***: that leads to problems for sure,
[13:21] ***VS***: jealousy but lots of others too
[13:21] Pirate Russell: Well, as a radio guy says, dont' believe what you hear, unless its consitant with whatyou already know!
[13:22] ***VS*** smiles
[13:23] ***VS***: well,
[13:24] ***VS***: Pirate I'd like to thank you for the class
[13:24] Pirate Russell: it is TRULY My pleasure!
[13:24] ***VS*** smiles
[13:24] ***VS***: it's good to take the time to think aobut these things with other people who are dealing with them