[0:20] Zealot Benmergui: Please remember that participation is encouraged, and there will also be time for discussion, questions and furry sex following the lecture.
[0:20] ***BB***: :)
[0:20] ***MM*** looks around for the goat
[0:20] Zealot Benmergui: Also, Your humble lecturer WILL accept tips as of this lecture, but they must be paid to me directly if you are so inclined, thank you.
[0:20] ***AG***: ooh furry sex
[0:20] ***AG***: claps
[0:20] Zealot Benmergui: The goat isn;t a furry, she's one of the family
[0:21] ***MM*** laughs
[0:21] Patrick Muggins: He must be talking about you Tora. *grins*
[0:21] Zealot Benmergui: Before we discuss endings, we must first mention a bit about beginnings.
[0:21] Zealot Benmergui: We all love beginnings. Beginnings are the fun stuff, the glory days. They even tend to have their own momentum; they can rush along like a bus driven by Sandra Bullock, only with a better body. Any flaws or mistakes early on tend to be hidden by the rosy glow of new love. We won't have to pay the price for them until later. The starts of relationships have all the elements we emotional vampires crave...romance, exploration, suspense, new discoveries, old confessions. Even bad sex can seem good at the beginning because it has the potential to become good. Beginnings are all about possibilities...and that effect is only intensified by being online. All we can see are the possibilities.
[0:21] Torakoun Sands smacks Pat, and shows of her sharp teeth
[0:21] Zealot Benmergui: Possibilities however, can be problematic.
[0:22] Zealot Benmergui: Some people like beginnings so much they have them over and over again. Every few days, a new Master or sub or one true love. They have to call them one true loves bcause saying "My 47 True Loves" makes them feel cheap. Today we are discussing endings however, so these serial soulmaters are not our concern. In fact part of the reason some people prefer endless beginnings is so that they can avoid the sting of endings in a haze of beginning euphoria.
[0:22] Zealot Benmergui: As with other breeds of dinosaur by the time the pain impulse reaches their brains, they are devouring the next unsuspecting herbivore with newbie hair and a silly prim penis. "Nymphotisaurus Rex", which is Latin for Terrible Lounge Lizard.
[0:23] Zealot Benmergui: Throw a rock in most BDSM clubs, you'll hit two if you can manage a bank shot.
[0:23] You: lol
[0:24] Zealot Benmergui: However, for we normal mammals, most beginnings also come with an eventual ending, or if we are lucky an eventual shift from lover to something else. Beginnings are easy, like falling off a satin sheet covered...endings are hard, and many elements of D/s relationships just make them harder because the focus on issues of co-dependence and duty is stronger. So much of the drama of D/s revolves around love due to fate, or preordination. How can fate change its mind?
[0:24] Zealot Benmergui: *satin sheet covered log
[0:25] Zealot Benmergui: Even thinking that something may not be working out can lead to guilt...which just causes us to hang on in relationships that should end for everyone's sake. No one wants to be the one that "fails" in a D/s relationship.
[0:25] Zealot Benmergui: breakups just AREN'T supposed to happen in "proper" D/s.
[0:26] Zealot Benmergui: A slave shouldn't suddenly decide that she just doesn't dig the furs of Master Firespurtter Fluffywhacker anymore, so she is packing up her 92 sets of silks in a shoebox and clearing out. "I am woman; hear me making fun of your lame lines in voicechat".
[0:26] Zealot Benmergui: A Master shouldn't decide that pure yet little Babe234 Formervirgin, the slave he had promised to protect and train until the stars turned cold and who he made a woman in his absurdly primmy 480 pose bed (all those other times didn't count since she swears she didn't cum) just isn't working out and she really needs to be banned from all his vast and regal domains and his fuckshack in Dreamland while he goes back to playing XBox with his kid brother all day. Bad form. Bad form. Fairy tales aren't supposed to end with "Stop IMing me you fucking freak or I'll report you to the Labs...."
[0:26] Zealot Benmergui: Hello my freaky darlings...
[0:27] Zealot Benmergui: damn that old voice emote..signs
[0:27] Evil Titler: ***MM*** needs a new title! To set it, anyone may say the text on /13. Maliene is not able to change it.
[0:27] Zealot Benmergui: Every fairtale ends with living happily ever after in your castle with Master and his wolfhounds and a giant tarn or two.
[0:27] Zealot Benmergui: So what do we do when our happily ever after doesn't rez?
[0:28] Zealot Benmergui: First of all, the worst breakups can be avoided by being sensible early on. Many elements that trip up a relationship are obvious at the beginning, we just choose to ignore or avoid them. After all, what are the three issues most often cited as a key reason in a breakup? Disagreements over Exclusivity (or the sneaky lack thereof), Time conflicts, and "They're an asshole and none of my friends like them". All three of these situations were probably apparent from the start, but we left to rot in the haze of “That will all be ok in the end, because we LOVVEEEE each other…”
[0:28] ***BB***: ban very bad contemporary 'literature'?
[0:28] Evil Titler: No-one gave ***MM*** a new title! Maliene will stay with the existing one for a while more.
[0:28] Zealot Benmergui: *smiles...Always possible, but people will make it up as they go if they must..fairytales are big business
[0:29] ***BB***: lol.. yes and Clearasil sales are up in Gor
[0:29] ***BB***: sorry
[0:29] ***BB***: <
[0:29] Zealot Benmergui: People assume that fundamental issues will fix themselves. They won’t. I have seen dozens of otherwise enjoyable, loving relationships get ripped to shreds over such things, and it all could have been avoided. Talk about them at the very beginning; make sure you are both on the same page. Make sure you know what they need, and what you need out of the relationship. Make sure you can live with the amount of time you will have to be together…and as odd as this sounds, make sure they like your friends, and that they like them. That kind of support, or lack thereof, can make or break a relationship.
[0:29] ***BB***: lol
[0:30] Zealot Benmergui: Each relationship stands or falls on it's own, but none are in a vacuum.
[0:30] Zealot Benmergui: Don;t expect yourlife to change to fit a relationship...you need the relationship to adapt to your life..if it won;t, something is wrong.
[0:30] Zealot Benmergui: If the person is an asshole at the beginning of a relationship, odds are they will remain so. You won’t be able to change it, you won’t be able to save them. You may be a saint with the hottest virtual body of all time and the carnal skills to make Ricky Martin straight…won’t do you any good. Frogs don’t become princes, no matter what part of them you kiss, or how often, or on which poseball. Accept it and move on to find some decent wart remover.
[0:31] Zealot Benmergui: An hopefully get the taste of frog out of your mouth.
[0:31] Zealot Benmergui: If an issue of time, or exclusivity is insurmountable at the beginning and is just causing conflict, I can’t urge you more strongly to step away THEN before either of you get too deeply involved. Spare yourself the tension and conflict that will inevitably come down the line, until you eventually have to break up anyway. If you know you need at least several hours a day with a Master, and he lives on the other side of the planet, and you will only be able to manage an hour at best, now and again, while he is getting dressed for work - it’s just not going to work.
[0:32] Zealot Benmergui: I don’t care how good that unexpected scene was or that chance meeting…keep them as a friend, an occasional partner, whatever, just do not expect them to be all you need to be, you will just frustrate them and disappoint yourself. Don’t fall into the trap of assuming that you need a committed, long term relationship with every friend you enjoy fucking occasionally. Let each relationship be what it can be, and enjoy them for what they are. if it becomes more then it started as, then count yourself lucky..just don;t count or demand it.
[0:33] Zealot Benmergui: Of course, all the wise preparation in the world often comes to naught, and for a billion different reasons. Sometimes a relationship just has to end and no advice I can give will make it pleasant. Remember first and foremost blame is useless, as is martyrdom. People always seem to throw it around like free condoms during a D/s breakup. All it does is obscure things and cause more pain…much like free condoms. Dignity and realism should be the ideals you strive for in ending a relationship, with a minimum of Drama. Don’t make it public, don’t spend ages venting at one another in group chat and don’t make it the topic of discussion for your friends for weeks. Share it with your near and dear, ask for advice when you need to, but try to avoid making it the gossip d’jour. If it has to end, end it quietly and gently…but also do it with authority.
[0:34] Zealot Benmergui: Too many people vacillate, hedging their bets and “sort of” break up with someone, in dribs and drabs since they can’t bring themselves to just do it, no matter what they may wish. That goes for Doms and subs alike. All that does is prolong the pain. If, as I have been often told, they will “just come apart if I break up with them, they won’t be able to handle it…” that just tells me it is all the more important for you to end it. A relationship needs to be made up of two (or more) individuals who can stand on their own otherwise it is unlikely any Collar could bear the weight. If they are depending on you in order to simply cope, you are doing them no favors staying.
[0:35] Zealot Benmergui: So once you decide you need to end a relationship, and that it needs to be done properly and directly..how? First of all, try not to do it by IM if you can avoid it. Face to virtual face is nice, or by email if you must so you have a chance to fully explain yourself. Try to explain WHY you feel it needs to end without being cruel or petty. Grace under pressure is a wonderful quality in a sub or a Dom.
[0:36] Zealot Benmergui: If you are a sub, be respectuful and polite but firm....and don;t let yourself be argued out of it or bullied...or put off.
[0:36] Zealot Benmergui: If you are a Dom be patient and gentle but also don;t give false hope. For you, it is even more important you make yourself clear as to your reasons. Just sending an IM reading "Get the fuck out Bitch" will not go over well.
[0:37] Zealot Benmergui: You will be surprised however, how often you will find when themoment comes, they are more relieved then upset, or also knew that this moment was approaching.
[0:38] Zealot Benmergui: Denial only goes so far...down to Sudan actually. We all tend to KNOW the truth even if we don;t accept it.
[0:38] Zealot Benmergui: So what happens after the breakup?
[0:38] You: make up sex?
[0:38] ***BB***: new hair?
[0:38] ***BB***: shoes?
[0:38] ***SS***: Follow the contract we have with our slaves?
[0:39] Zealot Benmergui: Most relationship sadly devolve into bitterness and name calling..and of course, heaping ladels of blame passed around like gruel in Oliver Twist...with subs saying "Please Sir, I want some MORE"
[0:39] Zealot Benmergui: *smiles...and yes, new wardrobes are often involved
[0:40] Zealot Benmergui: We all hope to remain friends with our exes, and it is certainly possible. The mistake people make is expecting it tohappen RIGHT AWAY
[0:40] ***BB***: ensings and haircuts are invariably psychologically tied
[0:40] Zealot Benmergui: any breakup needs some time to settle in, for the issues to die down, for the pain and hurt and whatever else to dissipate, at least to a degree
[0:40] Zealot Benmergui: Don;t expect that introducing her to your NEW slave the day after the breakup is going to be a fun day, or a good chance for a hot threesome
[0:41] ***BB***: nods.... it may result in an alt stalking and blowing up the Baronial domain?
[0:42] Zealot Benmergui: However, if you left with dignity, there is no reason not to send the occasional greeting, until such a time as you can both discuss what happened, and remember the things that made you wish to be together in the first place
[0:42] ***SS***: Sounds rather silly to do that. makes the dumpee feel like you got rid of them just for a piece of new ass
[0:42] Zealot Benmergui: That Miss ***BB*** is why I move a lot
[0:42] ***BB***: new asses... more expensive these days
[0:42] ***BB***: better scripting i guess
[0:43] ***BB***: :)
[0:43] Zealot Benmergui: I quite agree Miss***SS***, buit people have been known to be silly...or so I have noted
[0:43] ***BB***: and that is not even taking into account those with bunny-boiler tendencies
[0:43] ***BB***: nods solemnly
[0:43] ***SS***: Question
[0:44] Zealot Benmergui: Relationships end, collars are returned, it is a fact of life that we maynot like, but must accept...but there are ways to handle such events properly to spare everyone as much of the pain as possible
[0:44] Zealot Benmergui: Yes Miss***SS***?
[0:45] ***SS***: If you hve a slave contract with your slave, and it is stated you are to find them a new Dom/me, would it generally be easier to do this before or after the breakup?
[0:45] Zealot Benmergui: Contracts are a different wrinkle...and don;t tend to be as common in the online as they should be
[0:46] Zealot Benmergui: I would say it would be wisest to stipulate that in the contract...but in mots cases it would happen after the breakup, or at least after the acceptance that you need to split up
[0:46] ***SS***: Aye, i guess I am the odd woman, with contracts and play forms
[0:47] Zealot Benmergui: Odd is often CORRECT, and contracts work very well in many real life D/s relationships...if there were used more online, a lot of drama would be avoided.
[0:47] ***BB***: although my first ended by virtue of His death... He made allowance for a Guardian.. who then was available until such time as another match was identified
[0:47] Zealot Benmergui: They just are not the norm, since online hookups tend to be far more impulsive then RL...for obvious reasons
[0:47] ***BB***: this may be translatable to online?
[0:48] Zealot Benmergui: Certainly..I have acted as protector or guardian for many different women who wanted to a bit of security while looking for a new Master, as well as someone to advise them
[0:48] ***BB***: and it adds the benefit of a third party....
[0:48] Zealot Benmergui: We are rappidly movinginto questions now, so why fight the trend, since it moves us closer to the furry sex...
[0:49] ***BB***: a little distance during the healing time
[0:49] Zealot Benmergui: Therefore, the discussions rae now open...to remind, I do accept tips paid directly to me, thank you. No receipts.
[0:50] Zealot Benmergui: Nods...sometimes it is very useful to be advised by someone you trust, but who isn;t trying to collar you.
[0:50] ***BB***: even here it seems that where initial negotiations are effected and taken slowly and carefully, relationships seem to be more stable...... perhaps negotiation at the front end allows for the heat of 'passion' to cooln a little and clearer heads prevail?
[0:51] Zealot Benmergui: *nods...I agree completely...Things move much too fast online..that is great for a hookup, or an impulsive scene...but anything beyond that takes time to explore and consider.
[0:51] Zealot Benmergui: I work from the rule that if a connection feels right, back away for a day or two...
[0:51] ***SS***: Well, I find that play forms help them understand what a wide world they are in, and lets me know what they might or might not be interested in. Some I get in and find I'm not interested in, but I usually have someone i know that would be
[0:51] Zealot Benmergui: If it was the moment, you will find it dissipates...if it is real, you will still feel the same down the road.
[0:52] ***BB***: nods....
[0:52] Zealot Benmergui: And you can then also gauge them...if you IM them a couple days afte the great, impulsive sex you had, and they don;t see to remember who you are...danger, danger Will Robinson
[0:52] Zealot Benmergui: Never be afraid of taking your time.
[0:53] ***BB***: or if they want a collar straight away... but after declarations.. are chasing another within days.......
[0:53] ***SS***: Velcro collars
[0:53] ***BB***: whether Dom/me or sub.... run Forrest.. run
[0:53] Zealot Benmergui: How many of you have beenin relationships where you were able to remain friends afterwards?
[0:53] ***VV*** raises her hand
[0:53] ***SS***: I have, but not many
[0:53] ***MM*** raises her hand
[0:53] ***IM*** raiser her hand
[0:53] Zealot Benmergui: The ones that worked...how did you manage it?
[0:54] ***BB***: only had three... but apart from the Late one... other fine..
[0:54] ***BB***: respect
[0:54] ***BB***: trust that there is no intention to hurt
[0:54] ***SS***: usually the fact we took time going in, and when we split, it was under good terms
[0:54] ***IM***: W/we talked. A lot.
[0:54] ***BB***: nods
[0:54] Zealot Benmergui: nods...that is very important...another good reason to take it slowly
[0:55] Zealot Benmergui: Being friends before you are lovers is so important...Like before Lust before Love.
[0:55] ***BB***: and every step.. allows growth and renegotiation.. D/s requires so much active communication.. that small changes are often picked up quickly
[0:55] ***SS***: I'd say the one that hurt me the most was one that wanted to be with me because I do happen to be polyamorous, then left me for someone because she out of the blue decided she wanted a momogamous relationship
[0:56] Zealot Benmergui: I completely agree...the most important element in any relationship is always...What would your Mistress say, Miss ***IM***?
[0:56] ***IM***: communication!
[0:56] Zealot Benmergui: Thank you
[0:56] Zealot Benmergui: and yes Miss***SS***, changing the rules always causes a problem
[0:56] Zealot Benmergui: I have seen many cases of that.
[0:56] ***AG***: raises haNd
[0:57] Zealot Benmergui: Yes Miss ***AG***?
[0:57] ***AG***: 'sorry
[0:57] ***SS***: It would not be as much an issue if communication was kept up. But to just change it and assume the partner will know it is rather difficult at best, and can be a relationship breaker
[0:57] ***AG***: was answering the remining friends q
[0:57] ***BB***: agrees totally!
[0:57] ***AG***: =0
[0:58] ***PG***: das ist gut:
[0:58] ***BL***: wat is hier los???
[0:59] Zealot Benmergui: Communication can help in those situations, since oftentimes what starts as a misunderstanding gets out of control
[0:59] ***SS***: Aye, that i can agree with there
[0:59] Zealot Benmergui: it is also why you MUST be clear about such things as Exclusivity and other partners from the very beginning
[1:00] ***BB***: if relatively 'new' to the lifestyle.. having a Mentor can also be very helpful for B/both
[1:00] ***PG***: Sir......
[1:00] ***PG***: what if one was completely new?
[1:00] Zealot Benmergui: In most such cases, it isn;t the sex with another that is the problem...it is that it was not discussed in advance, or when against previously set rules
[1:00] Zealot Benmergui: New to the lifestyle overall, you mean?
[1:00] ***BB***: and in r/l sex with others tends to be with B/both present
[1:00] ***PG*** nods
[1:01] Zealot Benmergui: as a sub or as a DOm, Miss ***PG***?
[1:01] ***AG***: i ofr one am completely new-- i have taken it upon myself to go to every class i possibly can, and seek mentors as well that have years and years of experience --
[1:02] ***PG***: as a sub....
[1:02] ***SS***: This is actually why i use contracts. It lets the sub/slave know what their duties are, and what MY duties are
[1:02] Zealot Benmergui: Please do not be confused, I did not suddently split into two people....Miss ***?L*** here is my conscience.
[1:03] ***SS***: And in them I usually put a clase that states any significant changes must necessitate a new contract
[1:03] Zealot Benmergui: Nods..contracts can help people new to the lifestyle, but that requires a highly experienced and together Dom/Domme
[1:04] Zealot Benmergui: the best advice i can give a new sub is to go slow, and make no committments toanyone until you know what you really want
[1:04] Zealot Benmergui: enjoy, talk, flirt, fuck...learn what different styles are like, learn what things you enjoy, what things you hate
[1:04] Zealot Benmergui: when you finally do decide on a Master, make it an INFORMED choice
[1:05] ***BB***: remember that sub to a 'One' does not mean sub to all and sundry
[1:05] ***AG***: exactly
[1:05] ***AG***: informed choices are more likely to get better results
[1:05] ***SS***: And more erotic scenes
[1:05] Zealot Benmergui: Absolutely....being submissive does not mean 'doormat"...
[1:05] ***AG***: mmm
[1:06] ***SS*** waves to mazie
[1:06] Zealot Benmergui: If you are careful to explore in advance, then even should your first Collaring not end well, at least you will know if was not due to your inexperience, or lack of judgement
[1:06] ***mM***: Hi Miss... waves... and smiles
[1:06] Zealot Benmergui: all you can do is your best
[1:06] ***IM***: It is impossible to overstate the need for constant, honest communication. Even a contract is just a formal communication that will become stale and worthless as Y/you grow. If Y/you don't continue to communicate you will break up, and it will be messy.
[1:07] Zealot Benmergui: Yes, as Miss***SS*** mentioned, REnegotiation is essential
[1:07] Zealot Benmergui: we are all human beings...we change, sometimes day by day
[1:07] ***BB***: journals are also he;lpful as long at the Dom/me reads and feed back diligently
[1:08] ***BB***: they [provide a daily or weekly 'checkup'
[1:08] ***SS***: Aye. Contracts in and of themselves are not the end all, be all, but merely a starting point
[1:08] Zealot Benmergui: Mills ***BB*** and Miss ***SS*** are bringing up many excellent techniques that are sadly beyond the ken of most online Doms...but they are very very useful.
[1:08] ***BB***: they are translatable here
[1:08] ***BB***: just that many don't know about them
[1:08] ***BB***: blogs set to private make very good journals
[1:09] Zealot Benmergui: Indeed...or exchanging notecards regularly
[1:09] ***BB***: and offer opportunities to be very creative
[1:09] ***SS***: That's because too many forget about the comon basics and think with their sex organs, thinking quantity can overcome quality online
[1:09] ***BB***: nods.. yes
[1:09] Zealot Benmergui: Miss ***bB*** is referring to a technique where a sub is able to explore her feelings and thoughts in writing, and then her Dom/Domme reads and comments on her posts. Sometimes she may also mark a post as private, to keep it to herself at least initially.
[1:09] ***BB***: and because it really is not all about bouncing pixels and poseballs with a bit of heavy breathing
[1:10] Zealot Benmergui: This is most useful in long term relationships, allowing you to go back and see how far you have come, or the path you took
:10] Zealot Benmergui: As well as yo get feedback from your Dom/Domme outside of a scene or face to face
[1:11] ***SS***: A journal is something I had not thought about before
[1:11] ***BB***: spomwetimes i cannot find words.. but a song
[1:11] ***BB***: in r/l i can play it
[1:11] ***BB***: but online people can find on You Tube and embed in blog:)
[1:12] ***SS***: Zealot, can we please impale the AO HUD spam?
[1:12] Zealot Benmergui: They actually work well with the concept of contracting, since I know couples who created contracts, or in their case, written vows, based on the issues explored in the diaries
[1:12] Zealot Benmergui: Sadly, I can;t
[1:12] ***BB***: also the journal blog is a good place to put tasks or homework if difficult to get into sl
[1:13] Zealot Benmergui: Diaries can also be useful for the Dom in dealing with the sub...sometimes if He or She explores things in writing, they can be clearer to both parties
[1:13] ***BB***: nods.. exactly!
[1:13] ***BB***: but these things.. and contracts require.. thought, time, work
[1:14] ***BB***: even
[1:14] Zealot Benmergui: To bring this concept back to topic, having a written record can really strengthen a relationship, the warning signs can be seen and adressed before an issue splits you up
[1:14] ***BB***: cimmitment
[1:14] ***SS***: Well, I have been thinking of new ways to get feedback from my girls. That is something I'd never stopped to consider, online blogs and notecard journals
[1:14] ***BB***: it is good overt communication but it MUST go both ways
[1:14] ***BB***: otherwise they write.. and if not checked or commented on... it works to the contrary
[1:14] Zealot Benmergui: exactly..and time and though t taken means that you are less likely to find yourself in a relationship you should not be in...
[1:15] ***SS***: One cannot have too much communication with their subs, slaves, and pets
[1:15] ***BB***: nods :)) yes exactly... and that = less grief, less bunny boiling
[1:15] ***VS***: but
[1:15] Zealot Benmergui: I totally agree,,.,,even removing a collar is so much easier if you can communicate clearly and directly about it
[1:15] ***SS***: And more bunny sex?
[1:15] ***BB***: :))
[1:15] Zealot Benmergui: Yes Miss ***VS***?
[1:16] ***BB***: is that furry sex?
[1:16] Zealot Benmergui: it is..kust with duct tape
[1:16] ***SS***: Humping like a bunny, well that depends on your definition of furry sex
[1:16] ***BB***: my Dom is hirsute
[1:16] ***VS***: I mean I certainly agree, these are all great suggestions, you can't have too much communication of course but - it's a "real" virtual wrld we live in
[1:16] ***BB***: kinda
[1:16] ***BB***: furry
[1:16] ***BB***: *grins*
[1:16] ***VS***: you can't have too much but how little is not enough?
[1:17] Zealot Benmergui: That is a very good question
[1:17] ***BB***: i think when one feels that there is insufficient for their needs
[1:17] ***AG***: tyvm for the wonderful discussion as always but i must glo --- waves and is off =))
[1:17] ***BB***: be well Ana :)
[1:17] ***SS***: Veena, that's one that doesn't have a great answer. It really varies from relationship to relationship
[1:17] Zealot Benmergui: It is different for each relationship, but generally speaking if you feel that you aren;t being heard, or what you say is not being responded to...that is too little
[1:17] ***VS***: but.....
[1:18] ***VS***: so many people I talk to, feel that way all the time, it's a given
[1:18] ***BB***: many are unskilled at listening.. at hearing
[1:18] Zealot Benmergui: It is hard
[1:18] ***PG***: sir....may i ask a very...hmm...difficile question...?
[1:18] ***IM*** nods to Sir Zealot. If Y/you think there may be a problem, then there is too little communication.
[1:18] Zealot Benmergui: Does anyone think they are getting ENOUGH sex?
[1:18] ***MM*** nods
[1:18] ***VS*** laughs
[1:18] Zealot Benmergui: Well, besides Mali
[1:18] ***SS***: I'm barely getting enough sex
[1:19] Zealot Benmergui: When there is something we really wish, we always feel there is room for more...all subs feel they don;t ghet enough communication from their Doms..and vice versa
[1:20] Zealot Benmergui: Where it becomes an issue is when you look at it rationally..If you have not seen your Dom/sub or spoken to them in IM or otherwise in a week, without cause...or if you realise that there are events in your life you have not told them, but are now nolonger relevant..that is a problem
[1:20] ***BB***: and sometimes it isn't about enough.. but enough 'quality'... in other words.. online.. if in im's while talking to the One.. is not good.. too distracting and it comes through the communication i think
[1:20] ***IM*** nods
[1:20] Zealot Benmergui: Yes Miss ***PG***?
[1:22] ***SS***: I can say that is why I am poly. If I tried being mono, I'd be climbing the walls while they were laying spent O.o
[1:22] ***PG***: hmmm...thanks. if i got to know somewho...and he thinks i would NEVER want to live that way....and likes it....how can i turn things towards...trying out?
[1:22] ***PG***: hard to explain
[1:23] ***SS***: Well, use a play form, speak up, COMMUNICTE
[1:23] Zealot Benmergui: You are saying that a master that you wish to form a relationship with won't give you a chance to, due to the fact he thinks there are things about him you could not adapt to?
[1:23] ***PG*** sighs
[1:23] ***PG***: nothing more than this
[1:24] Zealot Benmergui: Or he is into something sexually hat you have not done before, and he doubts you could?
[1:24] ***PG***: what i mean is: i know he likes me more than anyone else in sl....but would not think i could be a sub....
[1:24] ***PG***: more the latter, yes
[1:24] ***SS***: Do what I did with my forst RL Domme
[1:25] ***PG***: this was...?
[1:25] ***SS***: I set a collar and leash on her table, and left it there a weekend. Then, I walked up, put it on, knelt at her feet, and handed her the handle
[1:25] Zealot Benmergui: tie him down to the barcalounger?
[1:25] ***BB***: Thank You for a most interesting talk Sir.... i must take my leave now :) Be well A/all
[1:26] Zealot Benmergui: That is definetly an approach, but online, you cna do the equivilant...
[1:26] ***PG*** nods
[1:26] Zealot Benmergui: be direct with him, say you would like to try
[1:26] Zealot Benmergui: may I ask if you have had sex online with him?
[1:26] ***PG***: this is so incrdibly......direct.
[1:26] ***SS***: Well, kinda hard to leave it on the table. But maybe slip it on, getting one that obviously LOOKS like a collar
[1:26] ***PG***: yes, we had
[1:27] ***PG*** smiles happily
[1:27] Zealot Benmergui: then while in bed with him, move what you are doing toward being more submissive
[1:27] Zealot Benmergui: you can find many many accounts of D/s or BDSM sex online, or elsewhere....
[1:28] Zealot Benmergui: if you act like a sub, and describe your actions as a sub, and submit to him in bed...it will be easier for you to show him that you Do wish to be in this lifestyle, and want him to guide you into it
[1:28] ***PG***: Thank u, sir....i might do so.
[1:28] ***SS***: Aye, but sometimes the subtle can be mistaken or misread, or just missed
[1:28] Zealot Benmergui: Th same way the direct can be misunderstood
[1:29] Zealot Benmergui: Just wearing a collar could work well, or he could assume someone ELSE has collared her
[1:29] ***SS***: I'd try it his way, and if he doesn't get the hint, try direct. If that doesn't work, I have a rack and rubber chicken to beat him with
[1:29] Zealot Benmergui: have your friends IM him and tell him how much you want to be his sub
[1:29] ***IM*** giggles
[1:30] ***IM***: Of course, if you're having that much trouble communicating, you may find being His sub is a mistake.
[1:30] Zealot Benmergui: This is also true
[1:30] Zealot Benmergui: Nothing is ever easy, or exactly what it seems to be
[1:30] ***SS***: I was about to say if you find you have to go to that level to talk, then things aren't gonna work
[1:31] ***IM***: but it could make a wonderful scene.
[1:31] ***PG***: hmmm.....we communicate in a perfect way
[1:31] Zealot Benmergui: nods...then definetly pursue it
[1:31] ***PG***: on and about everything
[1:31] ***PG***: but this topic
[1:32] Zealot Benmergui: often men, especially Doms, can get an Idee fixe
[1:32] ***PG***: i feel like being packed in a box: "too good for being sub"
[1:32] ***PG***: drives me crazy
[1:32] Zealot Benmergui: once it is in his head that you are vanilla, you need to be in times square being flogged by a dozen gay men in rainbow leather to convince them otherwise
[1:32] ***SS***: Women get that way too Zealot. It's a human thing, not a man or woman thing
[1:32] ***IM***: Some people think that when they become your Dom/me they can no longer be your friend. That makes them think they have to decide to be one or the other. And many prefer friendship.
[1:33] Zealot Benmergui: Quite true, Miss***SS***
[1:33] ***PG***: well...we r not only friends, dear
[1:33] ***PG***: but also.
[1:34] Zealot Benmergui: nods..sometimes the also makes it even harder to see someone in a new light
[1:35] ***SS***: Oh, friends and lovers?
[1:35] ***VS***: Shopping... can accomplish a great deal
[1:35] ***VS*** smiles
[1:35] ***PG***: i did that.....bought tons of fetish and sub stuff
[1:35] Zealot Benmergui: a GREAT deal
[1:36] Zealot Benmergui: which also is another aspect
[1:36] ***PG***: together
[1:36] Zealot Benmergui: take him to Xcite
[1:36] ***SS***: O.o
[1:36] Felicity Raghilda: -laughs-
[1:36] ***MM*** smiles
[1:36] Zealot Benmergui: didn;t work?
[1:36] ***PG***: to buy....what?
[1:36] ***SS***: Take him to Desade, not Xcite
[1:36] ***PG***: desade....?
[1:36] Zealot Benmergui: ease the poor fellow into it, Miss***SS***
[1:36] ***PG***: oh...it worked in a way....
[1:36] ***PG***: *smile
[1:37] Zealot Benmergui: then it sounds like you are making progress
[1:37] ***VS***: Also...
[1:37] ***SS***: Oh, forgive me. I can be more blunt than a cricket bat at times
[1:38] Zealot Benmergui: smiles...well, an admirable quality in a Domme, to be sure.,.especially the cricket bat part
[1:38] ***SS***: Well, I often find being blunt and direct gets what i want, while hinting and suggesting often just gets misunderstanding and lots of dead batteries
[1:39] Zealot Benmergui: laughs
[1:39] ***PG***: easy with a lover....harder with an also friend
[1:39] ***mM***: Thank You Sir.. i have to take my leave.. nice to see You Miss ***SS***.. Bye A/all
[1:39] Zealot Benmergui: Of course, I think we are coming to a close...
[1:40] Zealot Benmergui: remember, tipping is permitted and will helpme support my 47 subs and 346 prim babies
[1:40] Zealot Benmergui: also, my next lecture here at V will Sunday, 7 AM SLT\
[1:40] Zealot Benmergui: don't forget the goat
[1:40] Zealot Benmergui: the topic will be "The Sisterhood of the Tired Master: Life on the Chain gang"
[1:40] ***SS*** goes "Baaaaaaaa"
[1:40] Zealot Benmergui: the goat gets pricey
[1:41] Zealot Benmergui: my speaking schedule can be found on my blog...
[1:41] Zealot Benmergui: http://bardhaven.wordpress.com
[1:42] Zealot Benmergui: Please feel free to IM me with any questions you may have
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