[7:04] ***GM*** grins
[7:04] Payne Samiam: Here is my standard disclaimer I put at the start of my talks.
[7:05] Payne Samiam: A little about myself before we begin, i've been involve with D/s for about 10-12 years and by involved I mean real life london scene and midlands scene (UK), I have been a sub, slave(wore a gorean eternity collar rl for 6 months) and Master, i've looked after about 140 girls and 28 boys. I explore just about everything and try to keep an open mind.
[7:05] Payne Samiam: Now I know and understand alot of people keep there rl seperate from sl but I don't, i'm exactly the same here (except for body and hair lol) as rl, if I take on a girl here its same and I treat that girl exactly the same as if she was sitting next to me in this room now, I don't hide from drama and My only limits are those of the girl i'm with, i've had girls that i've been with on sl come stay with me and my wife rl i've also just looked after people and been Master online.
[7:05] Payne Samiam: So if anyone has questions after the class all I ask is that you respect who I am and what I do, I don't expect anyone to share anything with me they are not comfortable with but I don't need any "its just a game" friends :)
[7:06] Payne Samiam: This is ***LW*** who i'm 100% taken with, my view is if she gives me 100% then I give that in return, we are online but I treat her, train her and love her as if she was here next to me.
[7:07] ***AP***: wow.... someone finally gets it .... thanks Sir Payne
[7:07] ***LW*** hugs her Master's legs, careful not to tip him over
[7:07] ***HA***: agreed!!
[7:08] ***LW*** giggles and blushes
[7:08] Payne Samiam: I add to that she may be my sub by choice, but in being my sub she is equal to anyone else out there whether they think of themselves as Masters or others. she only submits to me.
[7:08] Payne Samiam: Welcome all
[7:08] Payne Samiam smiles
[7:08] Payne Samiam: Ohhh lots of people I get to mess up in front of an audience!
[7:09] ***KK***: Greetings ***ER***
[7:09] ***CV***: lol
[7:09] ***ER***:
[7:09] Payne Samiam: ***LW*** is abit quiet mainly because its only 50 mins before she hasto go work so will haveto go shower etc soon :0
[7:09] ***LW***: hehe
[7:09] Payne Samiam looks at ***LW*** and smiles softly
[7:10] Payne Samiam: okay I will start the Talk in about 1 minute anyone later than this can copy notes from someone else.
[7:11] Payne Samiam: Now.. I have a view of D/s and BDSM which sometimes puts me at odds with others in the scene.
[7:12] Payne Samiam: I don't expect anyone to 100% agree with me or follow what I say, this is from my point of view my experiences. i'm not perfect
[7:12] ***LW*** whispers...yes he is
[7:13] Payne Samiam: D/s and BDSM and all the other side kinks can be amazing but also dangerous.
[7:13] Payne Samiam: The right person can take you to heaven, the wrong person can take you to hell.
[7:14] Payne Samiam: One of the problems in D/s these days is its become fashionable, every wanabe on both sides thinks they can play at it.
[7:14] Payne Samiam: I'm all for people exploring the lifestyle but it sort of muddies the waters especially those that say its "just a game"
[7:15] Payne Samiam: How many of us have given our all only to find out the person we did so with lied about everything or it was just rp to them.
[7:15] Payne Samiam: How many of us had our hearts ripped out.
[7:16] Payne Samiam: For submissives/slaves/pets call them what you wish, there is real dangers.
[7:17] Payne Samiam: If you trust, if you allow them into your mind and they don't know what they are upto they can send you to a mental hospital.
[7:17] ***HS***: goes both ways i presume... dont give all untill you know whom you are dealing with
[7:17] Payne Samiam: On the side of a true Master it can be heart breaking to see a girl you can't reach because she has learnt all the bad side and the only examples of D/s etc.
[7:18] Payne Samiam: Yes
[7:18] Payne Samiam: Warning signs and red flags
[7:18] Payne Samiam: Most of them should be common sense
[7:19] Payne Samiam: if a girl comes to you and wants to give herself instantly, if she wants to be collared if she answers all the questions a little too quick.
[7:19] Payne Samiam: I once spent a day with a girl and every 10 minutes i'd ask her You do know this is real?
[7:19] Payne Samiam: yes she would answer
[7:20] Payne Samiam: You understand your giving yourself to me ?
[7:20] Payne Samiam: yes
[7:20] Payne Samiam: for the entire day this went on until I gave her a test
[7:20] Payne Samiam: I said okay ring up work your not going in tomorrow your staying home to serve me.
[7:20] Payne Samiam: I was bluffing
[7:20] Payne Samiam: i'd never do that.
[7:21] Payne Samiam: but within seconds she was like WTF
[7:21] ***HS***: how can you even want to collar one after only one day? you need to know one and know who they are... why take a gift if you dont know whom is giving...
[7:21] Payne Samiam: I was testing her
[7:21] ***HS***: why test her... thats not respectful... get to know her
[7:22] Payne Samiam: I tested her for her own wellbeing and sake
[7:22] ***ER***: Testing IS getting to know someone...
[7:22] Payne Samiam: I have been doing this for over 10 years now
[7:22] Payne Samiam: I knew she wasn't thinking about it
[7:22] Payne Samiam: I knew it wasn't the way it should be
[7:23] Payne Samiam: So I hadto put a situation in front of her
[7:23] Payne Samiam: that pulled her up short
[7:23] ***HA***: I agree with that way
[7:23] ***CV***: I do too.
[7:24] Payne Samiam: This was a girl who wanted to get into D/s so badly
[7:24] Payne Samiam: she was purely answering what she thought a Master would want to hear
[7:24] Payne Samiam: So I hadto find a way to get past that
[7:24] Payne Samiam: she wasn't for me I knew that from the start
[7:25] Payne Samiam: But I cared enough I wanted her to realise what she was offering
[7:25] Payne Samiam: Its abit like how easy it is these days for people to say they love you
[7:25] Payne Samiam: I hate to say it but most people don't understand what that means
[7:26] Payne Samiam: And true love is very rare
[7:26] Payne Samiam: but we hear people saying it all the same
[7:27] Payne Samiam: to me it was when my girlfriend at the time was diagnosed with cancer, I gave up my job and everything spent 18 hours a day at her bedside and married her knowing i'd be looking after her forever.
[7:27] Payne Samiam: and I don't regret that because I love her :)
[7:27] Payne Samiam: Welcome back love {{***LW*** had crashed and just returned}}
[7:28] Payne Samiam: There are submissives who have been hurt so bad they actively go out of there way to screw up a Master.
[7:29] Payne Samiam: But sadly most of the dangers and red flags we hear about are Masters and I hate to call them that.
[7:29] ***ER***: So, what about those who enjoy D/s, but can't commmit to a 24/7 lifestyle? Do you just dismiss them as dabblers?
[7:29] Payne Samiam: No aslong as your sincere
[7:29] Payne Samiam: its not about quantity of time its quality
[7:29] Payne Samiam: its about your intent
[7:30] Payne Samiam: are you in it to play with someone or does it actually mean something
[7:30] Payne Samiam: there is no set rules
[7:30] ***ER***: Why not both?
[7:30] Payne Samiam: Thats for you personally to decide
[7:30] Payne Samiam: And it may work if both of you feel like that
[7:32] Payne Samiam snuggles ***LW***
[7:32] ***ER***: Most of the folks I've met in the D/s or BDSM are "sceners"; only playing for that one scene, or evening, at a time.
[7:32] Payne Samiam: Most i've met are into it 100%
[7:33] Payne Samiam: ***LW*** is a submissive, now she is only submissive to me but she is still a submissive to me even if she is at work or not here with me.
[7:33] Payne Samiam: I am a Master it doesn't matter if i'm doing the shopping or playing fallout 3 :) i'm still a Master
[7:33] ***ER***: So, if you show up at her place of work, she's to drop everything and come kneel?
[7:33] ***HA***: wish more were like you!
[7:34] Payne Samiam: No let me explain
[7:34] Payne Samiam: As her Master I enhance her whole life
[7:34] Payne Samiam: from the moment she gets up
[7:34] Payne Samiam: till she sleeps
[7:34] Payne Samiam: at work she focus's on work
[7:34] Payne Samiam: and my energy my strength my love
[7:34] Payne Samiam: helps her focus
[7:35] Payne Samiam: I am proud of everything she does
[7:35] ***HA***: ***LW*** is very lucky to find someone like you Payne
[7:35] Payne Samiam: This is how I see it
[7:35] Payne Samiam: If your with the right Master then your whole life should be improved
[7:36] ***GM*** nods
[7:36] Payne Samiam: it doesn't matter if your 5000 miles away
[7:36] Payne Samiam: your teaching
[7:36] Payne Samiam: your help
[7:36] Payne Samiam: helps them do everything they need to
[7:36] Payne Samiam: And that is part of the responsibility of a good Master
[7:36] Payne Samiam: i've helped girls through college
[7:37] Payne Samiam: to get promotions
[7:37] Payne Samiam: to go for tests and get through illness
[7:37] Payne Samiam: To me thats part of taking on a girl
[7:37] ***RD*** nods " Please excuse us Payne is very enjoyable discussion but lotto and myself must be departing for some quiet time"
[7:37] Payne Samiam: If your with the right Master your rl your family your home your job should never be harmed
[7:38] Payne Samiam: OKay have fun :)
[7:38] Payne Samiam: So yes you can be 100% into D/s and still have your home life your work your job etc and if done right it should improve every part.
[7:38] Payne Samiam: Being a good Master is hard work
[7:39] Payne Samiam: the rewards are amazing, but its hard work your literally looking after another human being
[7:39] Payne Samiam: before the yummy sex, training, hypnosis, kinky stuff :) comes the mental and physical wellbeing
[7:39] Payne Samiam: This brings us on to the red flags and warning
[7:40] Payne Samiam: I will tell you what to look for in good Masters therefor from that you will get what is bad
[7:40] Payne Samiam: Most good Masters don't need that title
[7:40] Payne Samiam: don't need even Sir
[7:41] Payne Samiam: The only person who should ever call them Master or Sir is there submissive and ONLY if she really believes it
[7:41] Payne Samiam: whether that takes 60 hours or 60 days
[7:41] Payne Samiam: So if you see someone going around with a title its usually a bad sign
[7:42] Payne Samiam: My sub is the only one who can ever tell anyone if i'm a good Master because she is the one who knows
[7:42] Payne Samiam: Same goes for a Master who comes along and gives you a set of rules or tasks
[7:43] Payne Samiam: a script
[7:43] Payne Samiam: Every girl or boy i've ever looked after is unique
[7:43] Payne Samiam: You listen you find out what they want
[7:43] Payne Samiam: you get to know them
[7:43] Payne Samiam: exploring each others limits and needs
[7:44] Payne Samiam: Respect is earned on both sides
[7:44] Payne Samiam: Never ever give yourself to someone because they demand it, wait until they earn that privalige
[7:44] ***aW*** nods
[7:45] Payne Samiam: Another really good sign in a Master
[7:45] Payne Samiam: the ability to laugh and have fun
[7:45] Payne Samiam: And by that I don't mean cruelty or emotional humiliation
[7:46] Payne Samiam: i'm talking about being able to just let go and have fun with your girl
[7:46] Payne Samiam: A good Master or Dom also will have experience of being a submissive, simply because even if it isn't the norm, a person who has experienced what its like on the other side
[7:47] Payne Samiam: is much more likely to understand a Submissives needs
[7:47] Payne Samiam: If a Master can't let go then there is the chance of them being a control freak or powertripper
[7:47] Payne Samiam: and your in trouble with either of them.
[7:48] Payne Samiam: I've met Masters who couldn't even let there girl know that she pleased them and made them cum
[7:48] Payne Samiam: some bullshit reasoning that it showed weakness
[7:48] Free Radar HUD v1.1 by Crystal Gadgets
[7:48] Payne Samiam: If I want my girl to be open with me then its a two way street
[7:49] ***ER***'s Clit: **Heavy lag detected. Reach Out Xtra turned off.
[7:49] ***GM*** nods
[7:49] Payne Samiam: Now lets open this to poking fun at my ideas and picking me apart or agreeing etc in other words discussions and talkie talkie questions.
[7:50] ***ER***'s Clit: **Heavy lag is gone. Reach Out Xtra turned back on!
[7:50] Payne Samiam leans down and kisses his yumilicous girl
[7:50] Payne Samiam: Don't all speak at ones, your scaring me!
[7:51] Payne Samiam hides behind ***LW***
[7:51] ***CV***: I have been reading about natureal order and i think it is correct. so i don't really agree with the last part that a master has to have been a submissive.
[7:51] ***CV***: natural^
[7:52] You: well, the best Dom(me)s I've know have been switches.
[7:52] ***CV***: I think what draws people to the lifestyle is that it feels right.
[7:52] Payne Samiam: I'm a natural Master but I was told by a very good friend that the best way for me to know and learn how to be a good Master was to try it.
[7:52] ***CV***: And you said most that you know are scenes correct ***ER***?
[7:52] ***KK***: Payne, How many subs should/could a master have at one time? Or do you know an average number?
[7:52] Payne Samiam: So I tried it as a submissive/slave
[7:52] Payne Samiam: Well i've looked after upto 28 but let me explain that
[7:52] ***CV***: I thknk tha tis good but i don't think all Master's need to.
[7:53] ***ZB***: I know it works for some...I have found just listening and taking the concerns of subs seriously can have the same effect if you do so from a desire to learn, and empathize with their experiences
[7:53] Payne Samiam: I split my girls into pairs so each one had support
[7:53] Payne Samiam: And teachers
[7:53] ***GM***: What was the most important thing that you took away away with you from your time as a sub? What ment the most?
[7:54] Payne Samiam: But at that time I was looking after girls because they needed to be looked after, now i've found ***LW*** I would say with the right sub you only need or want one
[7:54] Payne Samiam: As a sub I found out many things, I started as a sub but ended up as a rl gorean slave wearing a steel collar
[7:54] ***ZB***: would you say you were the master for eachof those girls, or their Protector?
[7:55] Payne Samiam: At that point i'd say to most of them I was a protector
[7:55] ***ZB***: nods\
[7:55] ***LW*** thinks..the number of girls a Master has should be a unique question for each relationship....I consider myself happiest with a 1 on 1 situation, but in the past I have had an amazing time being one of 2 or one of 5. it all depends on the uniqueness of each relatiomship
[7:55] Payne Samiam: Yes
[7:55] ***ZB***: *agrees with Miss Writer
[7:55] Payne Samiam: It all depends on who your with
[7:56] ***ZB***: Though I would say more then 3-5 time issues become a problem, more then anything else
[7:56] ***ER*** gave you Payne's BDSM lecture..
[7:56] ***CV***: I agree.
[7:56] Payne Samiam: As a sub I found out how vulnerable you can be. how the words the feelings the slightest look from the one who you give yourself too can give you bliss or tear you apart
[7:57] ***LW***: and everyone should be part of a family.. it is very hard to get a bunch of jealous girls together..grins..but each should be treated with love and respect...and each girl should not feel like their 'position' is in perordy, or acting out when they do not get time - that is a sign that needs to be worked on...1 on 1.
[7:57] Payne Samiam: How I did it before when I had more than one is this, I never chose the new girls I always let my girls bring new girls too me, there choice
[7:57] ***LW***: YES! very improtant
[7:58] ***LW***: everyone chooses together
[7:58] Payne Samiam: That way its not a Master imposing a new girl on a group etc
[7:58] ***LW***: family
[7:58] Payne Samiam: it can really mess things up
[7:58] Payne Samiam: Family
[7:58] Payne Samiam: it hasto be
[7:58] Payne Samiam: And that isn't easy to find
[7:58] Payne Samiam: Did I miss any questions
[7:59] ***TS*** giggles quitely to herself, Communication!
[7:59] Payne Samiam: Yes
[7:59] Payne Samiam: that goes *laughs* without saying hehe
[7:59] ***LW*** nods
[7:59] Payne Samiam: And never assume
[8:00] ***CV***: Do Dom's/Master's have red flags they watch for?
[8:00] Payne Samiam: assume makes an ass of u and me and its never truer than in D/s and Bdsm
[8:00] Payne Samiam: Yes
[8:00] ***KK***: Thank you for the class Payne. I must depart now.
[8:00] ***LW*** has 10 years experience rl with being a submissive, also has written on bondage.com and is a writer of short stories. :)
[8:00] ***LW*** snuggles her love
[8:01] Payne Samiam: As a Master. personally
[8:01] Payne Samiam: alot of the flags revolve around a girl who well it looks like she has read all the how to's
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